Show that $(C([a,b]),|{cdot}|_2)$ is not a complete normed vector space











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Problem: Show that $(C([a,b]),|{cdot}|_2)$ is not a complete normed vector space.



I have tried to proceed along the lines given in the accepted answer, and subsequent comment, to this question: Example of a non complete normed vector space. Although, I am running into difficulties and wondering if the example really generalises so well when we have a general $[a,b]$. Is the Cauchy sequence I have chosen below a valid one, or have I overlooked a much simpler example to use in this case?



Attempt: In order to show that $(C([a,b]),|{cdot}|_2)$ is not a complete normed vector space we need to show that there is some Cauchy sequence that does not converge to it's limit in $C([a,b])$. In particular, it will suffice to show that our chosen Cauchy sequence converges under $|cdot|_2$ to a discontinuous function.



Consider the following sequence of functions, $(f_n)_{n=1}^inftysubset C([a,b])$, given by,



$$f_n(x)=begin{cases}
0,,text{when},,xin[a,frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}] \[2ex]
1,,text{when},,xin[frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},b] \[2ex]
frac{(2x-b+a)(b-a)-2^{-n+1}}{2^{-n+2}},,text{when},,xin[frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}]
end{cases}
$$



The definition of $f_n(x)$ when $xin[frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}]$ is the linear interpolant over that particular subinterval of $[a,b]$.



I claim that this is a Cauchy sequence. We consider:



$$|f_n-f_m|_2^2=int_a^b|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx$$



$$=int_a^{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+int_{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^b|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx$$



$$=0+int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+0$$



The $0$'s for the first and last integrals because we have $f_n(x)-f_m(x)=0-0$ and $f_n(x)-f_m(x)=1-1$ on each respectively. As to the middle integral, here is what I've gotten so far:



$$int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx=int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|(2x-b-a)(b-a)(2^{n-2}-2^{m-2})|^2dx$$



Based in the example I am following, supposing that $mge n$, I think that I should be able to argue that the whole thing is bound above by $frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}$ which would mean that $|f_n-f_m|_2^2lefrac{2^{-n}}{b-a}to0$ as $ntoinfty$.



I don't quite see how I'm meant to bound it above by $frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}$, as I keep tripping up over applying that $mge n$, leading me to question whether the approach I have employed here is a fruitful one after all.










share|cite|improve this question
























  • one of the functions dominates the other, so you just have to subtract the individual integrals. Can you integrate linear function?
    – Jorge Fernández
    Mar 14 at 22:29








  • 1




    instead of $frac{b-a}{2}$ you should have $frac{b+a}{2}$
    – orangeskid
    Mar 15 at 1:58















up vote
4
down vote

favorite












Problem: Show that $(C([a,b]),|{cdot}|_2)$ is not a complete normed vector space.



I have tried to proceed along the lines given in the accepted answer, and subsequent comment, to this question: Example of a non complete normed vector space. Although, I am running into difficulties and wondering if the example really generalises so well when we have a general $[a,b]$. Is the Cauchy sequence I have chosen below a valid one, or have I overlooked a much simpler example to use in this case?



Attempt: In order to show that $(C([a,b]),|{cdot}|_2)$ is not a complete normed vector space we need to show that there is some Cauchy sequence that does not converge to it's limit in $C([a,b])$. In particular, it will suffice to show that our chosen Cauchy sequence converges under $|cdot|_2$ to a discontinuous function.



Consider the following sequence of functions, $(f_n)_{n=1}^inftysubset C([a,b])$, given by,



$$f_n(x)=begin{cases}
0,,text{when},,xin[a,frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}] \[2ex]
1,,text{when},,xin[frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},b] \[2ex]
frac{(2x-b+a)(b-a)-2^{-n+1}}{2^{-n+2}},,text{when},,xin[frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}]
end{cases}
$$



The definition of $f_n(x)$ when $xin[frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}]$ is the linear interpolant over that particular subinterval of $[a,b]$.



I claim that this is a Cauchy sequence. We consider:



$$|f_n-f_m|_2^2=int_a^b|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx$$



$$=int_a^{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+int_{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^b|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx$$



$$=0+int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+0$$



The $0$'s for the first and last integrals because we have $f_n(x)-f_m(x)=0-0$ and $f_n(x)-f_m(x)=1-1$ on each respectively. As to the middle integral, here is what I've gotten so far:



$$int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx=int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|(2x-b-a)(b-a)(2^{n-2}-2^{m-2})|^2dx$$



Based in the example I am following, supposing that $mge n$, I think that I should be able to argue that the whole thing is bound above by $frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}$ which would mean that $|f_n-f_m|_2^2lefrac{2^{-n}}{b-a}to0$ as $ntoinfty$.



I don't quite see how I'm meant to bound it above by $frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}$, as I keep tripping up over applying that $mge n$, leading me to question whether the approach I have employed here is a fruitful one after all.










share|cite|improve this question
























  • one of the functions dominates the other, so you just have to subtract the individual integrals. Can you integrate linear function?
    – Jorge Fernández
    Mar 14 at 22:29








  • 1




    instead of $frac{b-a}{2}$ you should have $frac{b+a}{2}$
    – orangeskid
    Mar 15 at 1:58













up vote
4
down vote

favorite









up vote
4
down vote

favorite











Problem: Show that $(C([a,b]),|{cdot}|_2)$ is not a complete normed vector space.



I have tried to proceed along the lines given in the accepted answer, and subsequent comment, to this question: Example of a non complete normed vector space. Although, I am running into difficulties and wondering if the example really generalises so well when we have a general $[a,b]$. Is the Cauchy sequence I have chosen below a valid one, or have I overlooked a much simpler example to use in this case?



Attempt: In order to show that $(C([a,b]),|{cdot}|_2)$ is not a complete normed vector space we need to show that there is some Cauchy sequence that does not converge to it's limit in $C([a,b])$. In particular, it will suffice to show that our chosen Cauchy sequence converges under $|cdot|_2$ to a discontinuous function.



Consider the following sequence of functions, $(f_n)_{n=1}^inftysubset C([a,b])$, given by,



$$f_n(x)=begin{cases}
0,,text{when},,xin[a,frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}] \[2ex]
1,,text{when},,xin[frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},b] \[2ex]
frac{(2x-b+a)(b-a)-2^{-n+1}}{2^{-n+2}},,text{when},,xin[frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}]
end{cases}
$$



The definition of $f_n(x)$ when $xin[frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}]$ is the linear interpolant over that particular subinterval of $[a,b]$.



I claim that this is a Cauchy sequence. We consider:



$$|f_n-f_m|_2^2=int_a^b|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx$$



$$=int_a^{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+int_{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^b|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx$$



$$=0+int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+0$$



The $0$'s for the first and last integrals because we have $f_n(x)-f_m(x)=0-0$ and $f_n(x)-f_m(x)=1-1$ on each respectively. As to the middle integral, here is what I've gotten so far:



$$int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx=int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|(2x-b-a)(b-a)(2^{n-2}-2^{m-2})|^2dx$$



Based in the example I am following, supposing that $mge n$, I think that I should be able to argue that the whole thing is bound above by $frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}$ which would mean that $|f_n-f_m|_2^2lefrac{2^{-n}}{b-a}to0$ as $ntoinfty$.



I don't quite see how I'm meant to bound it above by $frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}$, as I keep tripping up over applying that $mge n$, leading me to question whether the approach I have employed here is a fruitful one after all.










share|cite|improve this question















Problem: Show that $(C([a,b]),|{cdot}|_2)$ is not a complete normed vector space.



I have tried to proceed along the lines given in the accepted answer, and subsequent comment, to this question: Example of a non complete normed vector space. Although, I am running into difficulties and wondering if the example really generalises so well when we have a general $[a,b]$. Is the Cauchy sequence I have chosen below a valid one, or have I overlooked a much simpler example to use in this case?



Attempt: In order to show that $(C([a,b]),|{cdot}|_2)$ is not a complete normed vector space we need to show that there is some Cauchy sequence that does not converge to it's limit in $C([a,b])$. In particular, it will suffice to show that our chosen Cauchy sequence converges under $|cdot|_2$ to a discontinuous function.



Consider the following sequence of functions, $(f_n)_{n=1}^inftysubset C([a,b])$, given by,



$$f_n(x)=begin{cases}
0,,text{when},,xin[a,frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}] \[2ex]
1,,text{when},,xin[frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},b] \[2ex]
frac{(2x-b+a)(b-a)-2^{-n+1}}{2^{-n+2}},,text{when},,xin[frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}]
end{cases}
$$



The definition of $f_n(x)$ when $xin[frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a},frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}]$ is the linear interpolant over that particular subinterval of $[a,b]$.



I claim that this is a Cauchy sequence. We consider:



$$|f_n-f_m|_2^2=int_a^b|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx$$



$$=int_a^{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+int_{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^b|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx$$



$$=0+int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx+0$$



The $0$'s for the first and last integrals because we have $f_n(x)-f_m(x)=0-0$ and $f_n(x)-f_m(x)=1-1$ on each respectively. As to the middle integral, here is what I've gotten so far:



$$int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2dx=int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|(2x-b-a)(b-a)(2^{n-2}-2^{m-2})|^2dx$$



Based in the example I am following, supposing that $mge n$, I think that I should be able to argue that the whole thing is bound above by $frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}$ which would mean that $|f_n-f_m|_2^2lefrac{2^{-n}}{b-a}to0$ as $ntoinfty$.



I don't quite see how I'm meant to bound it above by $frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}$, as I keep tripping up over applying that $mge n$, leading me to question whether the approach I have employed here is a fruitful one after all.







real-analysis functional-analysis banach-spaces norm normed-spaces






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edited Dec 4 at 10:37









Masacroso

12.7k41746




12.7k41746










asked Mar 14 at 22:20









Jeremy Jeffrey James

912613




912613












  • one of the functions dominates the other, so you just have to subtract the individual integrals. Can you integrate linear function?
    – Jorge Fernández
    Mar 14 at 22:29








  • 1




    instead of $frac{b-a}{2}$ you should have $frac{b+a}{2}$
    – orangeskid
    Mar 15 at 1:58


















  • one of the functions dominates the other, so you just have to subtract the individual integrals. Can you integrate linear function?
    – Jorge Fernández
    Mar 14 at 22:29








  • 1




    instead of $frac{b-a}{2}$ you should have $frac{b+a}{2}$
    – orangeskid
    Mar 15 at 1:58
















one of the functions dominates the other, so you just have to subtract the individual integrals. Can you integrate linear function?
– Jorge Fernández
Mar 14 at 22:29






one of the functions dominates the other, so you just have to subtract the individual integrals. Can you integrate linear function?
– Jorge Fernández
Mar 14 at 22:29






1




1




instead of $frac{b-a}{2}$ you should have $frac{b+a}{2}$
– orangeskid
Mar 15 at 1:58




instead of $frac{b-a}{2}$ you should have $frac{b+a}{2}$
– orangeskid
Mar 15 at 1:58










1 Answer
1






active

oldest

votes

















up vote
2
down vote



accepted










Use the mean value theorem:




$$int_a^b f(x),dx = (b-a)f(c), text{ for some } cin langle a , brangle$$




In particular, since your $f_n(x) in [0,1]$, we have:



begin{align}
int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2,dx &= left(frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} - frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} right)underbrace{|f_n(c) - f_m(c)|^2}_{le 2^2 = 4}\
&le 8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0
end{align}



Therefore, your sequence is Cauchy.






share|cite|improve this answer





















  • I would never have thought to use the MVT, thanks. I guess it's the exact same procedure for showing that $f_nto f$ as $ntoinfty$ where $f$ is the step function on $[a,b]$? In fact, one gets, exactly as you did here, a bound above of $8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0$ - is this correct?
    – Jeremy Jeffrey James
    Mar 15 at 13:22











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1 Answer
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1 Answer
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active

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active

oldest

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up vote
2
down vote



accepted










Use the mean value theorem:




$$int_a^b f(x),dx = (b-a)f(c), text{ for some } cin langle a , brangle$$




In particular, since your $f_n(x) in [0,1]$, we have:



begin{align}
int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2,dx &= left(frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} - frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} right)underbrace{|f_n(c) - f_m(c)|^2}_{le 2^2 = 4}\
&le 8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0
end{align}



Therefore, your sequence is Cauchy.






share|cite|improve this answer





















  • I would never have thought to use the MVT, thanks. I guess it's the exact same procedure for showing that $f_nto f$ as $ntoinfty$ where $f$ is the step function on $[a,b]$? In fact, one gets, exactly as you did here, a bound above of $8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0$ - is this correct?
    – Jeremy Jeffrey James
    Mar 15 at 13:22















up vote
2
down vote



accepted










Use the mean value theorem:




$$int_a^b f(x),dx = (b-a)f(c), text{ for some } cin langle a , brangle$$




In particular, since your $f_n(x) in [0,1]$, we have:



begin{align}
int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2,dx &= left(frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} - frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} right)underbrace{|f_n(c) - f_m(c)|^2}_{le 2^2 = 4}\
&le 8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0
end{align}



Therefore, your sequence is Cauchy.






share|cite|improve this answer





















  • I would never have thought to use the MVT, thanks. I guess it's the exact same procedure for showing that $f_nto f$ as $ntoinfty$ where $f$ is the step function on $[a,b]$? In fact, one gets, exactly as you did here, a bound above of $8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0$ - is this correct?
    – Jeremy Jeffrey James
    Mar 15 at 13:22













up vote
2
down vote



accepted







up vote
2
down vote



accepted






Use the mean value theorem:




$$int_a^b f(x),dx = (b-a)f(c), text{ for some } cin langle a , brangle$$




In particular, since your $f_n(x) in [0,1]$, we have:



begin{align}
int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2,dx &= left(frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} - frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} right)underbrace{|f_n(c) - f_m(c)|^2}_{le 2^2 = 4}\
&le 8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0
end{align}



Therefore, your sequence is Cauchy.






share|cite|improve this answer












Use the mean value theorem:




$$int_a^b f(x),dx = (b-a)f(c), text{ for some } cin langle a , brangle$$




In particular, since your $f_n(x) in [0,1]$, we have:



begin{align}
int_{frac{b-a}2-frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}^{frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a}}|f_n(x)-f_m(x)|^2,dx &= left(frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} - frac{b-a}2+frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} right)underbrace{|f_n(c) - f_m(c)|^2}_{le 2^2 = 4}\
&le 8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0
end{align}



Therefore, your sequence is Cauchy.







share|cite|improve this answer












share|cite|improve this answer



share|cite|improve this answer










answered Mar 14 at 22:35









mechanodroid

25k62245




25k62245












  • I would never have thought to use the MVT, thanks. I guess it's the exact same procedure for showing that $f_nto f$ as $ntoinfty$ where $f$ is the step function on $[a,b]$? In fact, one gets, exactly as you did here, a bound above of $8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0$ - is this correct?
    – Jeremy Jeffrey James
    Mar 15 at 13:22


















  • I would never have thought to use the MVT, thanks. I guess it's the exact same procedure for showing that $f_nto f$ as $ntoinfty$ where $f$ is the step function on $[a,b]$? In fact, one gets, exactly as you did here, a bound above of $8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0$ - is this correct?
    – Jeremy Jeffrey James
    Mar 15 at 13:22
















I would never have thought to use the MVT, thanks. I guess it's the exact same procedure for showing that $f_nto f$ as $ntoinfty$ where $f$ is the step function on $[a,b]$? In fact, one gets, exactly as you did here, a bound above of $8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0$ - is this correct?
– Jeremy Jeffrey James
Mar 15 at 13:22




I would never have thought to use the MVT, thanks. I guess it's the exact same procedure for showing that $f_nto f$ as $ntoinfty$ where $f$ is the step function on $[a,b]$? In fact, one gets, exactly as you did here, a bound above of $8cdot frac{2^{-n}}{b-a} xrightarrow{ntoinfty} 0$ - is this correct?
– Jeremy Jeffrey James
Mar 15 at 13:22


















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