Computing the Laplacian in Polar Coordinates [duplicate]












3












$begingroup$



This question already has an answer here:




  • Computing second partial derivative with polar coordinates

    1 answer




Similar questions have been asked on this site but none of them seemed to help me. I'm asked to compute the Laplacian $$frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}+frac{partial^2}{partial y^2}$$ in terms of polar coordinates.



I did do it, but I don't understand why what I did is correct, and I don't understand the more "brute force" way to do it at all.



Here is what I did:




I calculated $frac{partial}{partial r}$ and $frac{partial}{partial theta}$ in terms of $r,$ $theta,$ $frac{partial}{partial x}$ and $frac{partial}{partial y}.$ This gave me a system of linear equations which I wrote as
$$begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial r} \frac{partial}{partial theta}end{pmatrix} = begin{pmatrix}costheta & sintheta \ -rsintheta & rcostheta end{pmatrix}begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial x} \frac{partial}{partial y}end{pmatrix}.$$
I inverted to get $$begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial x} \frac{partial}{partial y}end{pmatrix} = frac{1}{r}begin{pmatrix}rcostheta & -sintheta \ rsintheta & costheta end{pmatrix}begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial r} \frac{partial}{partial theta}end{pmatrix},$$
and then I simply wrote begin{align}frac{partial^2}{partial x^2} &= frac{partial}{partial x} left( frac{partial}{partial x}right)\ &= left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)\ &= costhetafrac{partial}{partial r}left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right) -frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)\ &= cos^2theta frac{partial^2}{partial r^2} - frac{2}{r}sinthetacosthetafrac{partial^2}{partial r
partialtheta} +frac{1}{r^2}sin^2thetafrac{partial^2}{partial theta^2}.end{align}

I similarly got $$frac{partial^2}{partial y^2} = sin^2theta frac{partial^2}{partial r^2} + frac{2}{r}sinthetacosthetafrac{partial^2}{partial r
partialtheta} +frac{1}{r^2}cos^2thetafrac{partial^2}{partial theta^2}.$$
Adding the two yields $$frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}+frac{partial^2}{partial y^2} = frac{partial^2}{partial r^2}+frac{1}{r^2}frac{partial^2}{partial theta^2},$$
which Spivak says is correct.




Explicitly, here are my questions:




  1. In my solution, when I found $frac{partial^2}{partial x^2},$ I simply "multiplied" the expressions in the second line of the large aligned equation (treating multiplication of the partial operators as composition). Why am I allowed to do this? Why does the expression on the left not act on the thing on the right, forcing me to do the product rule and other nonsense to get the answer?


  2. My original idea was just to compute the Laplacian using the chain rule. That is, write $frac{partial}{partial x}=frac{partial}{partial r} frac{partial r}{partial x}$ and compute $frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ from there. My problem with this is that I keep getting confused about in which variables I should be writing everything, and how the partial derivative operators act on these other expressions. For example, I compute $frac{partial}{partial x}=frac{partial}{partial r} frac{partial r}{partial x} + frac{partial}{partial theta} frac{partial theta}{partial x} = frac{x}{sqrt{x^2+y^2}}frac{partial}{partial r} - frac{y}{x^2+y^2} frac{partial}{partial theta},$ but then I don't know where to go. Help understanding this method would be greatly appreciated.



If anything is unclear let me know and I'll make the necessary edits.










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$



marked as duplicate by Hans Lundmark, Lord Shark the Unknown, José Carlos Santos, Chris Custer, Cesareo Jan 8 at 16:14


This question has been asked before and already has an answer. If those answers do not fully address your question, please ask a new question.























    3












    $begingroup$



    This question already has an answer here:




    • Computing second partial derivative with polar coordinates

      1 answer




    Similar questions have been asked on this site but none of them seemed to help me. I'm asked to compute the Laplacian $$frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}+frac{partial^2}{partial y^2}$$ in terms of polar coordinates.



    I did do it, but I don't understand why what I did is correct, and I don't understand the more "brute force" way to do it at all.



    Here is what I did:




    I calculated $frac{partial}{partial r}$ and $frac{partial}{partial theta}$ in terms of $r,$ $theta,$ $frac{partial}{partial x}$ and $frac{partial}{partial y}.$ This gave me a system of linear equations which I wrote as
    $$begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial r} \frac{partial}{partial theta}end{pmatrix} = begin{pmatrix}costheta & sintheta \ -rsintheta & rcostheta end{pmatrix}begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial x} \frac{partial}{partial y}end{pmatrix}.$$
    I inverted to get $$begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial x} \frac{partial}{partial y}end{pmatrix} = frac{1}{r}begin{pmatrix}rcostheta & -sintheta \ rsintheta & costheta end{pmatrix}begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial r} \frac{partial}{partial theta}end{pmatrix},$$
    and then I simply wrote begin{align}frac{partial^2}{partial x^2} &= frac{partial}{partial x} left( frac{partial}{partial x}right)\ &= left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)\ &= costhetafrac{partial}{partial r}left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right) -frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)\ &= cos^2theta frac{partial^2}{partial r^2} - frac{2}{r}sinthetacosthetafrac{partial^2}{partial r
    partialtheta} +frac{1}{r^2}sin^2thetafrac{partial^2}{partial theta^2}.end{align}

    I similarly got $$frac{partial^2}{partial y^2} = sin^2theta frac{partial^2}{partial r^2} + frac{2}{r}sinthetacosthetafrac{partial^2}{partial r
    partialtheta} +frac{1}{r^2}cos^2thetafrac{partial^2}{partial theta^2}.$$
    Adding the two yields $$frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}+frac{partial^2}{partial y^2} = frac{partial^2}{partial r^2}+frac{1}{r^2}frac{partial^2}{partial theta^2},$$
    which Spivak says is correct.




    Explicitly, here are my questions:




    1. In my solution, when I found $frac{partial^2}{partial x^2},$ I simply "multiplied" the expressions in the second line of the large aligned equation (treating multiplication of the partial operators as composition). Why am I allowed to do this? Why does the expression on the left not act on the thing on the right, forcing me to do the product rule and other nonsense to get the answer?


    2. My original idea was just to compute the Laplacian using the chain rule. That is, write $frac{partial}{partial x}=frac{partial}{partial r} frac{partial r}{partial x}$ and compute $frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ from there. My problem with this is that I keep getting confused about in which variables I should be writing everything, and how the partial derivative operators act on these other expressions. For example, I compute $frac{partial}{partial x}=frac{partial}{partial r} frac{partial r}{partial x} + frac{partial}{partial theta} frac{partial theta}{partial x} = frac{x}{sqrt{x^2+y^2}}frac{partial}{partial r} - frac{y}{x^2+y^2} frac{partial}{partial theta},$ but then I don't know where to go. Help understanding this method would be greatly appreciated.



    If anything is unclear let me know and I'll make the necessary edits.










    share|cite|improve this question











    $endgroup$



    marked as duplicate by Hans Lundmark, Lord Shark the Unknown, José Carlos Santos, Chris Custer, Cesareo Jan 8 at 16:14


    This question has been asked before and already has an answer. If those answers do not fully address your question, please ask a new question.





















      3












      3








      3





      $begingroup$



      This question already has an answer here:




      • Computing second partial derivative with polar coordinates

        1 answer




      Similar questions have been asked on this site but none of them seemed to help me. I'm asked to compute the Laplacian $$frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}+frac{partial^2}{partial y^2}$$ in terms of polar coordinates.



      I did do it, but I don't understand why what I did is correct, and I don't understand the more "brute force" way to do it at all.



      Here is what I did:




      I calculated $frac{partial}{partial r}$ and $frac{partial}{partial theta}$ in terms of $r,$ $theta,$ $frac{partial}{partial x}$ and $frac{partial}{partial y}.$ This gave me a system of linear equations which I wrote as
      $$begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial r} \frac{partial}{partial theta}end{pmatrix} = begin{pmatrix}costheta & sintheta \ -rsintheta & rcostheta end{pmatrix}begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial x} \frac{partial}{partial y}end{pmatrix}.$$
      I inverted to get $$begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial x} \frac{partial}{partial y}end{pmatrix} = frac{1}{r}begin{pmatrix}rcostheta & -sintheta \ rsintheta & costheta end{pmatrix}begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial r} \frac{partial}{partial theta}end{pmatrix},$$
      and then I simply wrote begin{align}frac{partial^2}{partial x^2} &= frac{partial}{partial x} left( frac{partial}{partial x}right)\ &= left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)\ &= costhetafrac{partial}{partial r}left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right) -frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)\ &= cos^2theta frac{partial^2}{partial r^2} - frac{2}{r}sinthetacosthetafrac{partial^2}{partial r
      partialtheta} +frac{1}{r^2}sin^2thetafrac{partial^2}{partial theta^2}.end{align}

      I similarly got $$frac{partial^2}{partial y^2} = sin^2theta frac{partial^2}{partial r^2} + frac{2}{r}sinthetacosthetafrac{partial^2}{partial r
      partialtheta} +frac{1}{r^2}cos^2thetafrac{partial^2}{partial theta^2}.$$
      Adding the two yields $$frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}+frac{partial^2}{partial y^2} = frac{partial^2}{partial r^2}+frac{1}{r^2}frac{partial^2}{partial theta^2},$$
      which Spivak says is correct.




      Explicitly, here are my questions:




      1. In my solution, when I found $frac{partial^2}{partial x^2},$ I simply "multiplied" the expressions in the second line of the large aligned equation (treating multiplication of the partial operators as composition). Why am I allowed to do this? Why does the expression on the left not act on the thing on the right, forcing me to do the product rule and other nonsense to get the answer?


      2. My original idea was just to compute the Laplacian using the chain rule. That is, write $frac{partial}{partial x}=frac{partial}{partial r} frac{partial r}{partial x}$ and compute $frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ from there. My problem with this is that I keep getting confused about in which variables I should be writing everything, and how the partial derivative operators act on these other expressions. For example, I compute $frac{partial}{partial x}=frac{partial}{partial r} frac{partial r}{partial x} + frac{partial}{partial theta} frac{partial theta}{partial x} = frac{x}{sqrt{x^2+y^2}}frac{partial}{partial r} - frac{y}{x^2+y^2} frac{partial}{partial theta},$ but then I don't know where to go. Help understanding this method would be greatly appreciated.



      If anything is unclear let me know and I'll make the necessary edits.










      share|cite|improve this question











      $endgroup$





      This question already has an answer here:




      • Computing second partial derivative with polar coordinates

        1 answer




      Similar questions have been asked on this site but none of them seemed to help me. I'm asked to compute the Laplacian $$frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}+frac{partial^2}{partial y^2}$$ in terms of polar coordinates.



      I did do it, but I don't understand why what I did is correct, and I don't understand the more "brute force" way to do it at all.



      Here is what I did:




      I calculated $frac{partial}{partial r}$ and $frac{partial}{partial theta}$ in terms of $r,$ $theta,$ $frac{partial}{partial x}$ and $frac{partial}{partial y}.$ This gave me a system of linear equations which I wrote as
      $$begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial r} \frac{partial}{partial theta}end{pmatrix} = begin{pmatrix}costheta & sintheta \ -rsintheta & rcostheta end{pmatrix}begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial x} \frac{partial}{partial y}end{pmatrix}.$$
      I inverted to get $$begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial x} \frac{partial}{partial y}end{pmatrix} = frac{1}{r}begin{pmatrix}rcostheta & -sintheta \ rsintheta & costheta end{pmatrix}begin{pmatrix}frac{partial}{partial r} \frac{partial}{partial theta}end{pmatrix},$$
      and then I simply wrote begin{align}frac{partial^2}{partial x^2} &= frac{partial}{partial x} left( frac{partial}{partial x}right)\ &= left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)\ &= costhetafrac{partial}{partial r}left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right) -frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}left(costheta frac{partial}{partial r}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partial theta}right)\ &= cos^2theta frac{partial^2}{partial r^2} - frac{2}{r}sinthetacosthetafrac{partial^2}{partial r
      partialtheta} +frac{1}{r^2}sin^2thetafrac{partial^2}{partial theta^2}.end{align}

      I similarly got $$frac{partial^2}{partial y^2} = sin^2theta frac{partial^2}{partial r^2} + frac{2}{r}sinthetacosthetafrac{partial^2}{partial r
      partialtheta} +frac{1}{r^2}cos^2thetafrac{partial^2}{partial theta^2}.$$
      Adding the two yields $$frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}+frac{partial^2}{partial y^2} = frac{partial^2}{partial r^2}+frac{1}{r^2}frac{partial^2}{partial theta^2},$$
      which Spivak says is correct.




      Explicitly, here are my questions:




      1. In my solution, when I found $frac{partial^2}{partial x^2},$ I simply "multiplied" the expressions in the second line of the large aligned equation (treating multiplication of the partial operators as composition). Why am I allowed to do this? Why does the expression on the left not act on the thing on the right, forcing me to do the product rule and other nonsense to get the answer?


      2. My original idea was just to compute the Laplacian using the chain rule. That is, write $frac{partial}{partial x}=frac{partial}{partial r} frac{partial r}{partial x}$ and compute $frac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ from there. My problem with this is that I keep getting confused about in which variables I should be writing everything, and how the partial derivative operators act on these other expressions. For example, I compute $frac{partial}{partial x}=frac{partial}{partial r} frac{partial r}{partial x} + frac{partial}{partial theta} frac{partial theta}{partial x} = frac{x}{sqrt{x^2+y^2}}frac{partial}{partial r} - frac{y}{x^2+y^2} frac{partial}{partial theta},$ but then I don't know where to go. Help understanding this method would be greatly appreciated.



      If anything is unclear let me know and I'll make the necessary edits.





      This question already has an answer here:




      • Computing second partial derivative with polar coordinates

        1 answer








      derivatives partial-derivative polar-coordinates






      share|cite|improve this question















      share|cite|improve this question













      share|cite|improve this question




      share|cite|improve this question








      edited Jan 7 at 23:56







      D. Brogan

















      asked Jan 7 at 22:36









      D. BroganD. Brogan

      738513




      738513




      marked as duplicate by Hans Lundmark, Lord Shark the Unknown, José Carlos Santos, Chris Custer, Cesareo Jan 8 at 16:14


      This question has been asked before and already has an answer. If those answers do not fully address your question, please ask a new question.









      marked as duplicate by Hans Lundmark, Lord Shark the Unknown, José Carlos Santos, Chris Custer, Cesareo Jan 8 at 16:14


      This question has been asked before and already has an answer. If those answers do not fully address your question, please ask a new question.
























          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

          votes


















          1












          $begingroup$


          I simply "multiplied"




          Imagine a function $f(x, y) = f(x(r,theta),y(r,theta)) = f(r,theta)$, you just found



          $$
          frac{partial f(x, y)}{partial x} = costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} equiv h
          $$



          Then apply it again



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial^2 f(x, y)}{partial x^2} &=&frac{partial h}{partial x} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial}{partial r}left[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta}right] - frac{1}{r}sinthetaleft[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} right]
          end{eqnarray}



          That when you think about it is the same thing you did. So actually multiplying is the right way of doing it. In general this is true for any operator, if $T$ is an operator then



          $$
          T^2f = T(Tf)
          $$




          My original idea was just to compute the Laplacian using the chain rule




          It is completely equivalent to what you did in the first step. Here's the first term



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial f}{partial x} &=& frac{partial r}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial r} + frac{partial theta}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& frac{x}{r}frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{y}{r^2}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{sintheta}{r}frac{partial f}{partial theta}
          end{eqnarray}



          and now apply the same logic as before






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$









          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I may have been unclear so I'll write this with a simpler example. Why is it that $frac{partial }{partial x}left(xfrac{partial}{partial x}right)=xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ and not $frac{partial}{partial x}+xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}?$ This is where my confusion about my solution lies.
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:45










          • $begingroup$
            Also, in the final aligned equation, did you really mean to write $frac{partial r}{partial x}=frac{r}{x}?$
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:46










          • $begingroup$
            @D.Brogan Nope, it was a typo $r/x$ (already fixed it). As for the question, it is the second one, why do you think it is the first one?
            $endgroup$
            – caverac
            Jan 8 at 0:11






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            When applying $frac{partial}{partial r}$ to $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta},$ what I did was I ignored the $frac{1}{r},$ obtaining $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ I would think that I would get $frac{1}{r^2}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ Why do I get the first and not the second?
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 8 at 0:36












          • $begingroup$
            This answer is not correct. When you apply the derivative for the second time, you need to take into account the Leibniz product rule, so that you also get some first order terms. So the expressions for the second derivatives in the question are wrong, you do not just “multiply”. The correct expression for $partial^2 / partial x^2$ is given in this answer.
            $endgroup$
            – Hans Lundmark
            Jan 8 at 5:51


















          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

          votes








          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

          votes









          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

          votes









          1












          $begingroup$


          I simply "multiplied"




          Imagine a function $f(x, y) = f(x(r,theta),y(r,theta)) = f(r,theta)$, you just found



          $$
          frac{partial f(x, y)}{partial x} = costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} equiv h
          $$



          Then apply it again



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial^2 f(x, y)}{partial x^2} &=&frac{partial h}{partial x} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial}{partial r}left[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta}right] - frac{1}{r}sinthetaleft[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} right]
          end{eqnarray}



          That when you think about it is the same thing you did. So actually multiplying is the right way of doing it. In general this is true for any operator, if $T$ is an operator then



          $$
          T^2f = T(Tf)
          $$




          My original idea was just to compute the Laplacian using the chain rule




          It is completely equivalent to what you did in the first step. Here's the first term



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial f}{partial x} &=& frac{partial r}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial r} + frac{partial theta}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& frac{x}{r}frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{y}{r^2}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{sintheta}{r}frac{partial f}{partial theta}
          end{eqnarray}



          and now apply the same logic as before






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$









          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I may have been unclear so I'll write this with a simpler example. Why is it that $frac{partial }{partial x}left(xfrac{partial}{partial x}right)=xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ and not $frac{partial}{partial x}+xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}?$ This is where my confusion about my solution lies.
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:45










          • $begingroup$
            Also, in the final aligned equation, did you really mean to write $frac{partial r}{partial x}=frac{r}{x}?$
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:46










          • $begingroup$
            @D.Brogan Nope, it was a typo $r/x$ (already fixed it). As for the question, it is the second one, why do you think it is the first one?
            $endgroup$
            – caverac
            Jan 8 at 0:11






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            When applying $frac{partial}{partial r}$ to $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta},$ what I did was I ignored the $frac{1}{r},$ obtaining $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ I would think that I would get $frac{1}{r^2}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ Why do I get the first and not the second?
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 8 at 0:36












          • $begingroup$
            This answer is not correct. When you apply the derivative for the second time, you need to take into account the Leibniz product rule, so that you also get some first order terms. So the expressions for the second derivatives in the question are wrong, you do not just “multiply”. The correct expression for $partial^2 / partial x^2$ is given in this answer.
            $endgroup$
            – Hans Lundmark
            Jan 8 at 5:51
















          1












          $begingroup$


          I simply "multiplied"




          Imagine a function $f(x, y) = f(x(r,theta),y(r,theta)) = f(r,theta)$, you just found



          $$
          frac{partial f(x, y)}{partial x} = costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} equiv h
          $$



          Then apply it again



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial^2 f(x, y)}{partial x^2} &=&frac{partial h}{partial x} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial}{partial r}left[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta}right] - frac{1}{r}sinthetaleft[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} right]
          end{eqnarray}



          That when you think about it is the same thing you did. So actually multiplying is the right way of doing it. In general this is true for any operator, if $T$ is an operator then



          $$
          T^2f = T(Tf)
          $$




          My original idea was just to compute the Laplacian using the chain rule




          It is completely equivalent to what you did in the first step. Here's the first term



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial f}{partial x} &=& frac{partial r}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial r} + frac{partial theta}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& frac{x}{r}frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{y}{r^2}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{sintheta}{r}frac{partial f}{partial theta}
          end{eqnarray}



          and now apply the same logic as before






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$









          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I may have been unclear so I'll write this with a simpler example. Why is it that $frac{partial }{partial x}left(xfrac{partial}{partial x}right)=xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ and not $frac{partial}{partial x}+xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}?$ This is where my confusion about my solution lies.
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:45










          • $begingroup$
            Also, in the final aligned equation, did you really mean to write $frac{partial r}{partial x}=frac{r}{x}?$
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:46










          • $begingroup$
            @D.Brogan Nope, it was a typo $r/x$ (already fixed it). As for the question, it is the second one, why do you think it is the first one?
            $endgroup$
            – caverac
            Jan 8 at 0:11






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            When applying $frac{partial}{partial r}$ to $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta},$ what I did was I ignored the $frac{1}{r},$ obtaining $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ I would think that I would get $frac{1}{r^2}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ Why do I get the first and not the second?
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 8 at 0:36












          • $begingroup$
            This answer is not correct. When you apply the derivative for the second time, you need to take into account the Leibniz product rule, so that you also get some first order terms. So the expressions for the second derivatives in the question are wrong, you do not just “multiply”. The correct expression for $partial^2 / partial x^2$ is given in this answer.
            $endgroup$
            – Hans Lundmark
            Jan 8 at 5:51














          1












          1








          1





          $begingroup$


          I simply "multiplied"




          Imagine a function $f(x, y) = f(x(r,theta),y(r,theta)) = f(r,theta)$, you just found



          $$
          frac{partial f(x, y)}{partial x} = costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} equiv h
          $$



          Then apply it again



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial^2 f(x, y)}{partial x^2} &=&frac{partial h}{partial x} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial}{partial r}left[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta}right] - frac{1}{r}sinthetaleft[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} right]
          end{eqnarray}



          That when you think about it is the same thing you did. So actually multiplying is the right way of doing it. In general this is true for any operator, if $T$ is an operator then



          $$
          T^2f = T(Tf)
          $$




          My original idea was just to compute the Laplacian using the chain rule




          It is completely equivalent to what you did in the first step. Here's the first term



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial f}{partial x} &=& frac{partial r}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial r} + frac{partial theta}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& frac{x}{r}frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{y}{r^2}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{sintheta}{r}frac{partial f}{partial theta}
          end{eqnarray}



          and now apply the same logic as before






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$




          I simply "multiplied"




          Imagine a function $f(x, y) = f(x(r,theta),y(r,theta)) = f(r,theta)$, you just found



          $$
          frac{partial f(x, y)}{partial x} = costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} equiv h
          $$



          Then apply it again



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial^2 f(x, y)}{partial x^2} &=&frac{partial h}{partial x} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial h(r,theta)}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial}{partial r}left[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta}right] - frac{1}{r}sinthetaleft[costheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial r} - frac{1}{r}sintheta frac{partial f(r,theta)}{partial theta} right]
          end{eqnarray}



          That when you think about it is the same thing you did. So actually multiplying is the right way of doing it. In general this is true for any operator, if $T$ is an operator then



          $$
          T^2f = T(Tf)
          $$




          My original idea was just to compute the Laplacian using the chain rule




          It is completely equivalent to what you did in the first step. Here's the first term



          begin{eqnarray}
          frac{partial f}{partial x} &=& frac{partial r}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial r} + frac{partial theta}{partial x}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& frac{x}{r}frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{y}{r^2}frac{partial f}{partial theta} \
          &=& costheta frac{partial f}{partial r} - frac{sintheta}{r}frac{partial f}{partial theta}
          end{eqnarray}



          and now apply the same logic as before







          share|cite|improve this answer














          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer








          edited Jan 8 at 0:10

























          answered Jan 7 at 22:58









          caveraccaverac

          14.8k31130




          14.8k31130








          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I may have been unclear so I'll write this with a simpler example. Why is it that $frac{partial }{partial x}left(xfrac{partial}{partial x}right)=xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ and not $frac{partial}{partial x}+xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}?$ This is where my confusion about my solution lies.
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:45










          • $begingroup$
            Also, in the final aligned equation, did you really mean to write $frac{partial r}{partial x}=frac{r}{x}?$
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:46










          • $begingroup$
            @D.Brogan Nope, it was a typo $r/x$ (already fixed it). As for the question, it is the second one, why do you think it is the first one?
            $endgroup$
            – caverac
            Jan 8 at 0:11






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            When applying $frac{partial}{partial r}$ to $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta},$ what I did was I ignored the $frac{1}{r},$ obtaining $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ I would think that I would get $frac{1}{r^2}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ Why do I get the first and not the second?
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 8 at 0:36












          • $begingroup$
            This answer is not correct. When you apply the derivative for the second time, you need to take into account the Leibniz product rule, so that you also get some first order terms. So the expressions for the second derivatives in the question are wrong, you do not just “multiply”. The correct expression for $partial^2 / partial x^2$ is given in this answer.
            $endgroup$
            – Hans Lundmark
            Jan 8 at 5:51














          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I may have been unclear so I'll write this with a simpler example. Why is it that $frac{partial }{partial x}left(xfrac{partial}{partial x}right)=xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ and not $frac{partial}{partial x}+xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}?$ This is where my confusion about my solution lies.
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:45










          • $begingroup$
            Also, in the final aligned equation, did you really mean to write $frac{partial r}{partial x}=frac{r}{x}?$
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 7 at 23:46










          • $begingroup$
            @D.Brogan Nope, it was a typo $r/x$ (already fixed it). As for the question, it is the second one, why do you think it is the first one?
            $endgroup$
            – caverac
            Jan 8 at 0:11






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            When applying $frac{partial}{partial r}$ to $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta},$ what I did was I ignored the $frac{1}{r},$ obtaining $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ I would think that I would get $frac{1}{r^2}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ Why do I get the first and not the second?
            $endgroup$
            – D. Brogan
            Jan 8 at 0:36












          • $begingroup$
            This answer is not correct. When you apply the derivative for the second time, you need to take into account the Leibniz product rule, so that you also get some first order terms. So the expressions for the second derivatives in the question are wrong, you do not just “multiply”. The correct expression for $partial^2 / partial x^2$ is given in this answer.
            $endgroup$
            – Hans Lundmark
            Jan 8 at 5:51








          1




          1




          $begingroup$
          I may have been unclear so I'll write this with a simpler example. Why is it that $frac{partial }{partial x}left(xfrac{partial}{partial x}right)=xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ and not $frac{partial}{partial x}+xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}?$ This is where my confusion about my solution lies.
          $endgroup$
          – D. Brogan
          Jan 7 at 23:45




          $begingroup$
          I may have been unclear so I'll write this with a simpler example. Why is it that $frac{partial }{partial x}left(xfrac{partial}{partial x}right)=xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}$ and not $frac{partial}{partial x}+xfrac{partial^2}{partial x^2}?$ This is where my confusion about my solution lies.
          $endgroup$
          – D. Brogan
          Jan 7 at 23:45












          $begingroup$
          Also, in the final aligned equation, did you really mean to write $frac{partial r}{partial x}=frac{r}{x}?$
          $endgroup$
          – D. Brogan
          Jan 7 at 23:46




          $begingroup$
          Also, in the final aligned equation, did you really mean to write $frac{partial r}{partial x}=frac{r}{x}?$
          $endgroup$
          – D. Brogan
          Jan 7 at 23:46












          $begingroup$
          @D.Brogan Nope, it was a typo $r/x$ (already fixed it). As for the question, it is the second one, why do you think it is the first one?
          $endgroup$
          – caverac
          Jan 8 at 0:11




          $begingroup$
          @D.Brogan Nope, it was a typo $r/x$ (already fixed it). As for the question, it is the second one, why do you think it is the first one?
          $endgroup$
          – caverac
          Jan 8 at 0:11




          1




          1




          $begingroup$
          When applying $frac{partial}{partial r}$ to $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta},$ what I did was I ignored the $frac{1}{r},$ obtaining $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ I would think that I would get $frac{1}{r^2}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ Why do I get the first and not the second?
          $endgroup$
          – D. Brogan
          Jan 8 at 0:36






          $begingroup$
          When applying $frac{partial}{partial r}$ to $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta},$ what I did was I ignored the $frac{1}{r},$ obtaining $-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ I would think that I would get $frac{1}{r^2}sinthetafrac{partial}{partialtheta}-frac{1}{r}sinthetafrac{partial^2}{partialthetapartial r}.$ Why do I get the first and not the second?
          $endgroup$
          – D. Brogan
          Jan 8 at 0:36














          $begingroup$
          This answer is not correct. When you apply the derivative for the second time, you need to take into account the Leibniz product rule, so that you also get some first order terms. So the expressions for the second derivatives in the question are wrong, you do not just “multiply”. The correct expression for $partial^2 / partial x^2$ is given in this answer.
          $endgroup$
          – Hans Lundmark
          Jan 8 at 5:51




          $begingroup$
          This answer is not correct. When you apply the derivative for the second time, you need to take into account the Leibniz product rule, so that you also get some first order terms. So the expressions for the second derivatives in the question are wrong, you do not just “multiply”. The correct expression for $partial^2 / partial x^2$ is given in this answer.
          $endgroup$
          – Hans Lundmark
          Jan 8 at 5:51



          Popular posts from this blog

          Bressuire

          Cabo Verde

          Gyllenstierna