Asymptotic behavior of roots of an equation involving exponential and logarithm











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Prelude



This Post is a continuation of this Original Post. The original problem asked is:



How many solutions does the following equation have:



$$
a^x = log_a(x) ,,quad a in (0,1) wedge x inmathbb{R}^+_0
$$



And already has been answered (see Claude Leibovici's answer for details).



Observations



I found this problem interesting and I numerically investigated it a bit deeper. This led me to another question. Figures below show that such roots exist and are reals:



enter image description hereenter image description hereenter image description here



And roots can be computed numerically for several values of $a$:



enter image description here



My observations, so far, are:




  1. All roots must lie in $(0,1)$ because $log_a(x) > 0 , forall x in (0,1)$ and $log_a(x) < 0$ elsewhere, and $a^x > 0 ,forall x in mathbb{R}$;

  2. Solving this problem involves complex analysis (such as the use of Lambert W function) but the result will stay in the real domain;

  3. A "divergence" point occurs at $(e^{-e},e^{-1})$;

  4. Solving the original problem is equivalent to solve (base conversion and Lambert W properties):$$ln(a) = frac{Wleft(x ln(x)right)}{x} = frac{ln(x)}{x} Leftrightarrow a_k = expleft[frac{W_kleft(x ln(x)right)}{x}right]$$

  5. Roots become triple when $a < e^{-e}$ (dashed black vertical line, as shown by Claude Leibovici in his answer)


  6. Roots have asymptotic behavior, it can be checked in term of $a(x)$ for two branches:




    • one root tends to unity as $arightarrow 1$: $limlimits_{xrightarrow 1} a = 1$ (green curve rightmost);

    • two roots tend to zero as $arightarrow 0^+$: $limlimits_{xrightarrow 0^+} a = 0$ (green and orange curves leftmost).




Questions:



My main questions are:





  • How can I prove that one root tends to unity when base $arightarrow 0^+$ (blue curve leftmost)? By taking the limit of the proper branch.


  • Is the point 4 correct? Investigating the solution using Wolfram Alpha it seems both Leibovici and my expressions are equivalent. But the first form suffer a huge float arithmetic error with numpy library. Anyway they can be plotted using the latter form:


enter image description here



Side questions are:




  • How is called the point where branches diverge?

  • Do end of the branches also have a specific name?


  • Can we say that roots are multiple at the "divergence" point? If so, in what sense are they multiple? Claude Leibovici: Roots are multiple in the sense that three first degrees of Taylor expansion vanishes at $x=e^{-1}$ with $a=e^{-e}$.

  • Is the green branch a specific one because it behaves smoothly?










share|cite|improve this question




























    up vote
    3
    down vote

    favorite
    2












    Prelude



    This Post is a continuation of this Original Post. The original problem asked is:



    How many solutions does the following equation have:



    $$
    a^x = log_a(x) ,,quad a in (0,1) wedge x inmathbb{R}^+_0
    $$



    And already has been answered (see Claude Leibovici's answer for details).



    Observations



    I found this problem interesting and I numerically investigated it a bit deeper. This led me to another question. Figures below show that such roots exist and are reals:



    enter image description hereenter image description hereenter image description here



    And roots can be computed numerically for several values of $a$:



    enter image description here



    My observations, so far, are:




    1. All roots must lie in $(0,1)$ because $log_a(x) > 0 , forall x in (0,1)$ and $log_a(x) < 0$ elsewhere, and $a^x > 0 ,forall x in mathbb{R}$;

    2. Solving this problem involves complex analysis (such as the use of Lambert W function) but the result will stay in the real domain;

    3. A "divergence" point occurs at $(e^{-e},e^{-1})$;

    4. Solving the original problem is equivalent to solve (base conversion and Lambert W properties):$$ln(a) = frac{Wleft(x ln(x)right)}{x} = frac{ln(x)}{x} Leftrightarrow a_k = expleft[frac{W_kleft(x ln(x)right)}{x}right]$$

    5. Roots become triple when $a < e^{-e}$ (dashed black vertical line, as shown by Claude Leibovici in his answer)


    6. Roots have asymptotic behavior, it can be checked in term of $a(x)$ for two branches:




      • one root tends to unity as $arightarrow 1$: $limlimits_{xrightarrow 1} a = 1$ (green curve rightmost);

      • two roots tend to zero as $arightarrow 0^+$: $limlimits_{xrightarrow 0^+} a = 0$ (green and orange curves leftmost).




    Questions:



    My main questions are:





    • How can I prove that one root tends to unity when base $arightarrow 0^+$ (blue curve leftmost)? By taking the limit of the proper branch.


    • Is the point 4 correct? Investigating the solution using Wolfram Alpha it seems both Leibovici and my expressions are equivalent. But the first form suffer a huge float arithmetic error with numpy library. Anyway they can be plotted using the latter form:


    enter image description here



    Side questions are:




    • How is called the point where branches diverge?

    • Do end of the branches also have a specific name?


    • Can we say that roots are multiple at the "divergence" point? If so, in what sense are they multiple? Claude Leibovici: Roots are multiple in the sense that three first degrees of Taylor expansion vanishes at $x=e^{-1}$ with $a=e^{-e}$.

    • Is the green branch a specific one because it behaves smoothly?










    share|cite|improve this question


























      up vote
      3
      down vote

      favorite
      2









      up vote
      3
      down vote

      favorite
      2






      2





      Prelude



      This Post is a continuation of this Original Post. The original problem asked is:



      How many solutions does the following equation have:



      $$
      a^x = log_a(x) ,,quad a in (0,1) wedge x inmathbb{R}^+_0
      $$



      And already has been answered (see Claude Leibovici's answer for details).



      Observations



      I found this problem interesting and I numerically investigated it a bit deeper. This led me to another question. Figures below show that such roots exist and are reals:



      enter image description hereenter image description hereenter image description here



      And roots can be computed numerically for several values of $a$:



      enter image description here



      My observations, so far, are:




      1. All roots must lie in $(0,1)$ because $log_a(x) > 0 , forall x in (0,1)$ and $log_a(x) < 0$ elsewhere, and $a^x > 0 ,forall x in mathbb{R}$;

      2. Solving this problem involves complex analysis (such as the use of Lambert W function) but the result will stay in the real domain;

      3. A "divergence" point occurs at $(e^{-e},e^{-1})$;

      4. Solving the original problem is equivalent to solve (base conversion and Lambert W properties):$$ln(a) = frac{Wleft(x ln(x)right)}{x} = frac{ln(x)}{x} Leftrightarrow a_k = expleft[frac{W_kleft(x ln(x)right)}{x}right]$$

      5. Roots become triple when $a < e^{-e}$ (dashed black vertical line, as shown by Claude Leibovici in his answer)


      6. Roots have asymptotic behavior, it can be checked in term of $a(x)$ for two branches:




        • one root tends to unity as $arightarrow 1$: $limlimits_{xrightarrow 1} a = 1$ (green curve rightmost);

        • two roots tend to zero as $arightarrow 0^+$: $limlimits_{xrightarrow 0^+} a = 0$ (green and orange curves leftmost).




      Questions:



      My main questions are:





      • How can I prove that one root tends to unity when base $arightarrow 0^+$ (blue curve leftmost)? By taking the limit of the proper branch.


      • Is the point 4 correct? Investigating the solution using Wolfram Alpha it seems both Leibovici and my expressions are equivalent. But the first form suffer a huge float arithmetic error with numpy library. Anyway they can be plotted using the latter form:


      enter image description here



      Side questions are:




      • How is called the point where branches diverge?

      • Do end of the branches also have a specific name?


      • Can we say that roots are multiple at the "divergence" point? If so, in what sense are they multiple? Claude Leibovici: Roots are multiple in the sense that three first degrees of Taylor expansion vanishes at $x=e^{-1}$ with $a=e^{-e}$.

      • Is the green branch a specific one because it behaves smoothly?










      share|cite|improve this question















      Prelude



      This Post is a continuation of this Original Post. The original problem asked is:



      How many solutions does the following equation have:



      $$
      a^x = log_a(x) ,,quad a in (0,1) wedge x inmathbb{R}^+_0
      $$



      And already has been answered (see Claude Leibovici's answer for details).



      Observations



      I found this problem interesting and I numerically investigated it a bit deeper. This led me to another question. Figures below show that such roots exist and are reals:



      enter image description hereenter image description hereenter image description here



      And roots can be computed numerically for several values of $a$:



      enter image description here



      My observations, so far, are:




      1. All roots must lie in $(0,1)$ because $log_a(x) > 0 , forall x in (0,1)$ and $log_a(x) < 0$ elsewhere, and $a^x > 0 ,forall x in mathbb{R}$;

      2. Solving this problem involves complex analysis (such as the use of Lambert W function) but the result will stay in the real domain;

      3. A "divergence" point occurs at $(e^{-e},e^{-1})$;

      4. Solving the original problem is equivalent to solve (base conversion and Lambert W properties):$$ln(a) = frac{Wleft(x ln(x)right)}{x} = frac{ln(x)}{x} Leftrightarrow a_k = expleft[frac{W_kleft(x ln(x)right)}{x}right]$$

      5. Roots become triple when $a < e^{-e}$ (dashed black vertical line, as shown by Claude Leibovici in his answer)


      6. Roots have asymptotic behavior, it can be checked in term of $a(x)$ for two branches:




        • one root tends to unity as $arightarrow 1$: $limlimits_{xrightarrow 1} a = 1$ (green curve rightmost);

        • two roots tend to zero as $arightarrow 0^+$: $limlimits_{xrightarrow 0^+} a = 0$ (green and orange curves leftmost).




      Questions:



      My main questions are:





      • How can I prove that one root tends to unity when base $arightarrow 0^+$ (blue curve leftmost)? By taking the limit of the proper branch.


      • Is the point 4 correct? Investigating the solution using Wolfram Alpha it seems both Leibovici and my expressions are equivalent. But the first form suffer a huge float arithmetic error with numpy library. Anyway they can be plotted using the latter form:


      enter image description here



      Side questions are:




      • How is called the point where branches diverge?

      • Do end of the branches also have a specific name?


      • Can we say that roots are multiple at the "divergence" point? If so, in what sense are they multiple? Claude Leibovici: Roots are multiple in the sense that three first degrees of Taylor expansion vanishes at $x=e^{-1}$ with $a=e^{-e}$.

      • Is the green branch a specific one because it behaves smoothly?







      logarithms exponential-function roots lambert-w






      share|cite|improve this question















      share|cite|improve this question













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      edited Dec 4 at 10:27

























      asked Dec 3 at 12:34









      jlandercy

      251213




      251213






















          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

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          up vote
          1
          down vote



          accepted










          Probably not answering the questions but this is too long for comments.



          Considering the function $$f(x)=a^x-frac{log (x)}{log (a)}$$ its derivatives are
          $$f^{(n)}(x)=a^x log^n(a)+(-1)^n frac{(n-1)!}{x^n, log(a)}$$
          The first derivative cancels at two points given by
          $$x_1=frac{W_0left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}qquad text{and}qquad x_2=frac{W_{-1}left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}$$ which, in the real domain, exist if $frac{1}{log (a)}geq -frac 1 e$ that is to say if $a leq e^{-e}$. If this is the case, $f(x_1)<0$ and $f(x_2)>0$ which explains the three roots.



          What is interesting is to look at what happens when $a = e^{-e}$. For this value, the solution of $f(x)=0$ is unique $x=frac 1e$. At this point, the second derivative is also zero and the Taylor expansion is
          $$frac{e^2}{6} left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^3-frac{5e^3}{24}
          left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^4+Oleft(left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^5right)$$
          which makes that, at ths point, $x=frac 1e$ is a triple root of the equation.



          On another side, we could also solve the equation for $a$ and its solutions are given by
          $$a_1=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{0}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}qquad text{and}qquad a_2=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{-1}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}$$ which do exist if $x leq frac 1e$. These two functions are worth to be plotted.



          When $x to 1$ the expansion of $a_1$ is
          $$a_1=1+(x-1)-(x-1)^2+frac{1}{2} (x-1)^3+Oleft((x-1)^4right)$$ and using series reversion
          $$x= 1+(a_1-1)+Oleft((a_1-1)^2right)$$ making that if $xto 0 implies a_1 to 0$.






          share|cite|improve this answer





















          • Thank you for taking time to answer. I have updated my OP to integrate information you provided. I had problem to plot you expression of $a$ using numpy but I succeed with another form (looks like a float error propagation I think it is due to the fractional power that grows quickly as $x rightarrow 0$). Anyway Wolfram seems to show that both our versions agree.
            – jlandercy
            Dec 4 at 9:17













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          1 Answer
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          active

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          1 Answer
          1






          active

          oldest

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          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

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          up vote
          1
          down vote



          accepted










          Probably not answering the questions but this is too long for comments.



          Considering the function $$f(x)=a^x-frac{log (x)}{log (a)}$$ its derivatives are
          $$f^{(n)}(x)=a^x log^n(a)+(-1)^n frac{(n-1)!}{x^n, log(a)}$$
          The first derivative cancels at two points given by
          $$x_1=frac{W_0left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}qquad text{and}qquad x_2=frac{W_{-1}left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}$$ which, in the real domain, exist if $frac{1}{log (a)}geq -frac 1 e$ that is to say if $a leq e^{-e}$. If this is the case, $f(x_1)<0$ and $f(x_2)>0$ which explains the three roots.



          What is interesting is to look at what happens when $a = e^{-e}$. For this value, the solution of $f(x)=0$ is unique $x=frac 1e$. At this point, the second derivative is also zero and the Taylor expansion is
          $$frac{e^2}{6} left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^3-frac{5e^3}{24}
          left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^4+Oleft(left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^5right)$$
          which makes that, at ths point, $x=frac 1e$ is a triple root of the equation.



          On another side, we could also solve the equation for $a$ and its solutions are given by
          $$a_1=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{0}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}qquad text{and}qquad a_2=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{-1}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}$$ which do exist if $x leq frac 1e$. These two functions are worth to be plotted.



          When $x to 1$ the expansion of $a_1$ is
          $$a_1=1+(x-1)-(x-1)^2+frac{1}{2} (x-1)^3+Oleft((x-1)^4right)$$ and using series reversion
          $$x= 1+(a_1-1)+Oleft((a_1-1)^2right)$$ making that if $xto 0 implies a_1 to 0$.






          share|cite|improve this answer





















          • Thank you for taking time to answer. I have updated my OP to integrate information you provided. I had problem to plot you expression of $a$ using numpy but I succeed with another form (looks like a float error propagation I think it is due to the fractional power that grows quickly as $x rightarrow 0$). Anyway Wolfram seems to show that both our versions agree.
            – jlandercy
            Dec 4 at 9:17

















          up vote
          1
          down vote



          accepted










          Probably not answering the questions but this is too long for comments.



          Considering the function $$f(x)=a^x-frac{log (x)}{log (a)}$$ its derivatives are
          $$f^{(n)}(x)=a^x log^n(a)+(-1)^n frac{(n-1)!}{x^n, log(a)}$$
          The first derivative cancels at two points given by
          $$x_1=frac{W_0left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}qquad text{and}qquad x_2=frac{W_{-1}left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}$$ which, in the real domain, exist if $frac{1}{log (a)}geq -frac 1 e$ that is to say if $a leq e^{-e}$. If this is the case, $f(x_1)<0$ and $f(x_2)>0$ which explains the three roots.



          What is interesting is to look at what happens when $a = e^{-e}$. For this value, the solution of $f(x)=0$ is unique $x=frac 1e$. At this point, the second derivative is also zero and the Taylor expansion is
          $$frac{e^2}{6} left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^3-frac{5e^3}{24}
          left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^4+Oleft(left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^5right)$$
          which makes that, at ths point, $x=frac 1e$ is a triple root of the equation.



          On another side, we could also solve the equation for $a$ and its solutions are given by
          $$a_1=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{0}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}qquad text{and}qquad a_2=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{-1}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}$$ which do exist if $x leq frac 1e$. These two functions are worth to be plotted.



          When $x to 1$ the expansion of $a_1$ is
          $$a_1=1+(x-1)-(x-1)^2+frac{1}{2} (x-1)^3+Oleft((x-1)^4right)$$ and using series reversion
          $$x= 1+(a_1-1)+Oleft((a_1-1)^2right)$$ making that if $xto 0 implies a_1 to 0$.






          share|cite|improve this answer





















          • Thank you for taking time to answer. I have updated my OP to integrate information you provided. I had problem to plot you expression of $a$ using numpy but I succeed with another form (looks like a float error propagation I think it is due to the fractional power that grows quickly as $x rightarrow 0$). Anyway Wolfram seems to show that both our versions agree.
            – jlandercy
            Dec 4 at 9:17















          up vote
          1
          down vote



          accepted







          up vote
          1
          down vote



          accepted






          Probably not answering the questions but this is too long for comments.



          Considering the function $$f(x)=a^x-frac{log (x)}{log (a)}$$ its derivatives are
          $$f^{(n)}(x)=a^x log^n(a)+(-1)^n frac{(n-1)!}{x^n, log(a)}$$
          The first derivative cancels at two points given by
          $$x_1=frac{W_0left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}qquad text{and}qquad x_2=frac{W_{-1}left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}$$ which, in the real domain, exist if $frac{1}{log (a)}geq -frac 1 e$ that is to say if $a leq e^{-e}$. If this is the case, $f(x_1)<0$ and $f(x_2)>0$ which explains the three roots.



          What is interesting is to look at what happens when $a = e^{-e}$. For this value, the solution of $f(x)=0$ is unique $x=frac 1e$. At this point, the second derivative is also zero and the Taylor expansion is
          $$frac{e^2}{6} left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^3-frac{5e^3}{24}
          left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^4+Oleft(left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^5right)$$
          which makes that, at ths point, $x=frac 1e$ is a triple root of the equation.



          On another side, we could also solve the equation for $a$ and its solutions are given by
          $$a_1=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{0}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}qquad text{and}qquad a_2=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{-1}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}$$ which do exist if $x leq frac 1e$. These two functions are worth to be plotted.



          When $x to 1$ the expansion of $a_1$ is
          $$a_1=1+(x-1)-(x-1)^2+frac{1}{2} (x-1)^3+Oleft((x-1)^4right)$$ and using series reversion
          $$x= 1+(a_1-1)+Oleft((a_1-1)^2right)$$ making that if $xto 0 implies a_1 to 0$.






          share|cite|improve this answer












          Probably not answering the questions but this is too long for comments.



          Considering the function $$f(x)=a^x-frac{log (x)}{log (a)}$$ its derivatives are
          $$f^{(n)}(x)=a^x log^n(a)+(-1)^n frac{(n-1)!}{x^n, log(a)}$$
          The first derivative cancels at two points given by
          $$x_1=frac{W_0left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}qquad text{and}qquad x_2=frac{W_{-1}left(frac{1}{log (a)}right)}{log (a)}$$ which, in the real domain, exist if $frac{1}{log (a)}geq -frac 1 e$ that is to say if $a leq e^{-e}$. If this is the case, $f(x_1)<0$ and $f(x_2)>0$ which explains the three roots.



          What is interesting is to look at what happens when $a = e^{-e}$. For this value, the solution of $f(x)=0$ is unique $x=frac 1e$. At this point, the second derivative is also zero and the Taylor expansion is
          $$frac{e^2}{6} left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^3-frac{5e^3}{24}
          left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^4+Oleft(left(x-frac{1}{e}right)^5right)$$
          which makes that, at ths point, $x=frac 1e$ is a triple root of the equation.



          On another side, we could also solve the equation for $a$ and its solutions are given by
          $$a_1=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{0}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}qquad text{and}qquad a_2=left(frac{x log (x)}{W_{-1}(x log (x))}right)^{frac{1}{x}}$$ which do exist if $x leq frac 1e$. These two functions are worth to be plotted.



          When $x to 1$ the expansion of $a_1$ is
          $$a_1=1+(x-1)-(x-1)^2+frac{1}{2} (x-1)^3+Oleft((x-1)^4right)$$ and using series reversion
          $$x= 1+(a_1-1)+Oleft((a_1-1)^2right)$$ making that if $xto 0 implies a_1 to 0$.







          share|cite|improve this answer












          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer










          answered Dec 4 at 5:11









          Claude Leibovici

          117k1156131




          117k1156131












          • Thank you for taking time to answer. I have updated my OP to integrate information you provided. I had problem to plot you expression of $a$ using numpy but I succeed with another form (looks like a float error propagation I think it is due to the fractional power that grows quickly as $x rightarrow 0$). Anyway Wolfram seems to show that both our versions agree.
            – jlandercy
            Dec 4 at 9:17




















          • Thank you for taking time to answer. I have updated my OP to integrate information you provided. I had problem to plot you expression of $a$ using numpy but I succeed with another form (looks like a float error propagation I think it is due to the fractional power that grows quickly as $x rightarrow 0$). Anyway Wolfram seems to show that both our versions agree.
            – jlandercy
            Dec 4 at 9:17


















          Thank you for taking time to answer. I have updated my OP to integrate information you provided. I had problem to plot you expression of $a$ using numpy but I succeed with another form (looks like a float error propagation I think it is due to the fractional power that grows quickly as $x rightarrow 0$). Anyway Wolfram seems to show that both our versions agree.
          – jlandercy
          Dec 4 at 9:17






          Thank you for taking time to answer. I have updated my OP to integrate information you provided. I had problem to plot you expression of $a$ using numpy but I succeed with another form (looks like a float error propagation I think it is due to the fractional power that grows quickly as $x rightarrow 0$). Anyway Wolfram seems to show that both our versions agree.
          – jlandercy
          Dec 4 at 9:17




















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