How was copying prevented when the first CD-ROM games were introduced?
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Several ways exist to protect against the copying of games but, when CD-ROM games were first introduced, were there any measures taken by video game developers to prevent the copying of games?
history gaming cd-rom
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Several ways exist to protect against the copying of games but, when CD-ROM games were first introduced, were there any measures taken by video game developers to prevent the copying of games?
history gaming cd-rom
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4
Not only was there little/no protections, the original Diablo game came with a second CD which you could use to install the game (multi-player only) on friends' machines.
– David Rice
2 days ago
1
@DavidRice Except Diablo expects the CD to be in the drive at all times, so I guess they were effectively giving you 2 licenses. Happens I'm playing it right now...
– Harper
2 days ago
10
Size. It required 500 floppies to make a copy of a full cd, so the media itself was the copy protection. Later all kinds of cd-copying protections were added.
– Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen
yesterday
@ThorbjørnRavnAndersen - HA! I remember attempting to copy a game I had to a floppy disk once, and it was just an endless cycle of places new disks in the drive as each would fill up. I didn't know much about computers at the time, but I guess you're right.
– BasementJoe
yesterday
3
Took a long time until CD-R devices become affordable enough to buy by most people.
– mathreadler
yesterday
|
show 1 more comment
up vote
35
down vote
favorite
up vote
35
down vote
favorite
Several ways exist to protect against the copying of games but, when CD-ROM games were first introduced, were there any measures taken by video game developers to prevent the copying of games?
history gaming cd-rom
New contributor
Several ways exist to protect against the copying of games but, when CD-ROM games were first introduced, were there any measures taken by video game developers to prevent the copying of games?
history gaming cd-rom
history gaming cd-rom
New contributor
New contributor
edited 2 days ago
Community♦
1
1
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asked 2 days ago
BasementJoe
32329
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4
Not only was there little/no protections, the original Diablo game came with a second CD which you could use to install the game (multi-player only) on friends' machines.
– David Rice
2 days ago
1
@DavidRice Except Diablo expects the CD to be in the drive at all times, so I guess they were effectively giving you 2 licenses. Happens I'm playing it right now...
– Harper
2 days ago
10
Size. It required 500 floppies to make a copy of a full cd, so the media itself was the copy protection. Later all kinds of cd-copying protections were added.
– Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen
yesterday
@ThorbjørnRavnAndersen - HA! I remember attempting to copy a game I had to a floppy disk once, and it was just an endless cycle of places new disks in the drive as each would fill up. I didn't know much about computers at the time, but I guess you're right.
– BasementJoe
yesterday
3
Took a long time until CD-R devices become affordable enough to buy by most people.
– mathreadler
yesterday
|
show 1 more comment
4
Not only was there little/no protections, the original Diablo game came with a second CD which you could use to install the game (multi-player only) on friends' machines.
– David Rice
2 days ago
1
@DavidRice Except Diablo expects the CD to be in the drive at all times, so I guess they were effectively giving you 2 licenses. Happens I'm playing it right now...
– Harper
2 days ago
10
Size. It required 500 floppies to make a copy of a full cd, so the media itself was the copy protection. Later all kinds of cd-copying protections were added.
– Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen
yesterday
@ThorbjørnRavnAndersen - HA! I remember attempting to copy a game I had to a floppy disk once, and it was just an endless cycle of places new disks in the drive as each would fill up. I didn't know much about computers at the time, but I guess you're right.
– BasementJoe
yesterday
3
Took a long time until CD-R devices become affordable enough to buy by most people.
– mathreadler
yesterday
4
4
Not only was there little/no protections, the original Diablo game came with a second CD which you could use to install the game (multi-player only) on friends' machines.
– David Rice
2 days ago
Not only was there little/no protections, the original Diablo game came with a second CD which you could use to install the game (multi-player only) on friends' machines.
– David Rice
2 days ago
1
1
@DavidRice Except Diablo expects the CD to be in the drive at all times, so I guess they were effectively giving you 2 licenses. Happens I'm playing it right now...
– Harper
2 days ago
@DavidRice Except Diablo expects the CD to be in the drive at all times, so I guess they were effectively giving you 2 licenses. Happens I'm playing it right now...
– Harper
2 days ago
10
10
Size. It required 500 floppies to make a copy of a full cd, so the media itself was the copy protection. Later all kinds of cd-copying protections were added.
– Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen
yesterday
Size. It required 500 floppies to make a copy of a full cd, so the media itself was the copy protection. Later all kinds of cd-copying protections were added.
– Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen
yesterday
@ThorbjørnRavnAndersen - HA! I remember attempting to copy a game I had to a floppy disk once, and it was just an endless cycle of places new disks in the drive as each would fill up. I didn't know much about computers at the time, but I guess you're right.
– BasementJoe
yesterday
@ThorbjørnRavnAndersen - HA! I remember attempting to copy a game I had to a floppy disk once, and it was just an endless cycle of places new disks in the drive as each would fill up. I didn't know much about computers at the time, but I guess you're right.
– BasementJoe
yesterday
3
3
Took a long time until CD-R devices become affordable enough to buy by most people.
– mathreadler
yesterday
Took a long time until CD-R devices become affordable enough to buy by most people.
– mathreadler
yesterday
|
show 1 more comment
8 Answers
8
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oldest
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up vote
67
down vote
accepted
When CD-ROM games were first introduced, game developers didn’t take any measures to prevent users from copying them, for two main reasons:
- CD-ROMs could contain more data than most hard drives at the time;
- CD writers were rare, and extremely expensive.
The Wikipedia page on CD-R gives some idea of the expense involved: in 1990, CD recording systems cost over $35,000; by 1992, that had dropped to around $10,000, and the $1,000 barrier was crossed in 1995.
In those days, a hard drive large enough to store a copy of a CD-ROM (assuming the latter was filled to capacity) cost a significant amount too ($2,000 in 1992) — and you’d need one, on a SCSI system, to have any chance of copying a CD correctly. Blank CDs were also quite expensive.
Another limiting factor initially was that CD writers wrote CDs at the nominal speed, so copying a full CD would take over an hour (not counting the time it took to read it).
Many CD games did however rely on some CD characteristics to make them harder to copy to another medium: they’d check that their CD was present, or rely on audio CD tracks.
17
@cup that depends on the tool you use to copy — copying a CD image doesn’t depend on the number of files it contains.
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
8
At the time I had my first CD writer around 1997, blank CD-R media was about £5 a piece. The occasional buffer underrun created very expensive drinks coasters.
– bodgit
2 days ago
1
For games whose "meaningful" size is small, an easy way to protect a CD-ROM would have been to fill the CD with many copies of the game's data, each encrypted somewhat differently, and have the game select among them at random. Not only would the sheer bulk of the files have been an impediment to someone copying them all, but such redundancy could also allow the game to be usable even if part of the disk got damaged.
– supercat
2 days ago
4
Yep, I remember my first CD writer in 1998 and it was the sort of thing where nobody had them and everyone ended up going to "that guy" who had one when they wanted things burned. It took 35 minutes to burn a disc and if anyone jumped in the room or your OS decided to take a crap instead of filling the write buffer you'd end up with a rather expensive coffee coaster.
– J...
2 days ago
1
Also, Internet connections were either not a thing at all or else far too slow to share a CD's worth of data.
– reirab
2 days ago
|
show 6 more comments
up vote
27
down vote
We had some software delivered on a CD in which the vendor purposely put a defect on a specific track. If that defect wasn't there, the software could say it wasn't an original CD.
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
New contributor
10
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
Though only until HDD capacity caught up. Then software drivers to emulate CD drives and create disc images, including the defects, started showing up.
– jmbpiano
yesterday
2
What first started copying the defects that @jmbpiano mentions, I wonder? I remember using Alcohol 120% or, was it DaemonTools?, in mid 2000s for that. Would that be on topic here?
– muru
yesterday
2
On a specific track? I assume you mean on a specific sector, because data on a CD is arranged in a single spiral track.
– kasperd
yesterday
I seem to remember the discs for the original Playstation had these defects, and one of the programs that could copy those defects was Nero Burning ROM.
– pacoverflow
15 hours ago
Some defects can be copied, some can't; it depends on the drive. The trouble for the people creating the protection schemes is that some defects (notably those that are expected to return different data when re-read) are handled differently by different drives, so some schemes risk locking out legitimate users. The fancy virtual CD drivers that emulated defects made this obsolete.
– fadden
9 hours ago
|
show 1 more comment
up vote
15
down vote
(preface: While Stephen's answer already covers the basic points, I would like to put a different emphasis here - and merge in some private history :))
Short answer:
It was the game's size and the need to copy it to a CD again, combined with expensive and unreliable writers. Further, the CD itself was used as a copy protection. While games often got installed completely onto HD, they did check every now and then if the CD was still present in a drive connected, so people could not install and run it on multiple (friends') systems.
All of this is based around the fact, that copying CDs was expensive and unreliable - at least until the early 2000s.
In general, it's a bit like it was with floppies in the very beginning (my fist 10-pack did cost me 80 Marks), where copying to tape was prohibitive, just to be repeated in the mid 2000s when DVDs where rolled out when CD writing became cheap and reliable.
The Long Read
To start with, CD production was, at that time mostly confined to 'real' CDs and in a factory setup, as writeables not only where prohibitively expensive, but also did not always produce a result readable on (cheap) CD-ROM drives. When looking at prices it may be helpful to see that CDs weren't a thing for computer users until 1991's Soundblaster Pro got sold with a special interface for the Mitsumi CD Drive (and often packaged with one). Keep in mind this is about games. Here only mass market counts, not some high power users like many of us may have been.
CD as a game medium only started after that. At this time their sheer size was the most relevant copy protection. Game companies where often accused of adding unnecessary content to explicitly bloat the size of data used - including lots of clips and cut scenes together with purposely non-compressed data, to make it hard to copy games onto disks. In fact, numerous game reviews did test games that where delivered as a 'basic version' on floppies as well as their 'enhanced' CD counterpart and found that the CD-version didn't add anything useful.
While the cost for a CD writer in the mid-90s dropped close to 1000 USD, that's still above the usual juvenile threshold. And writers still suffered from compatibility issues with regular (cheap) players. Even if daddy did invest in the son's future by buying a PC with a well-fitted SCSI based machine including a writer, media prices were comparably high. When bought as a 25 pack, a single writeable CD was close to 10 USD. Thus copying did still bear high cost.
The time argument doesn't matter so much on the hobbyist side, as waiting an hour for the CD to complete (*1) could be filled with whatever teenagers do anyway :))
It doesn't matter on a 'professional' scale as well. Just remember all the copying that was going on during early 80s with pirated video tapes. People had a dozen VCRs in their garage, hooked up to a 'Master' and copied in real time. More or less the same way with CDs in the mid to late 90s. Machines did run multiple drives at once, just this time the master was a hard disk. 8-12 drives per machine and 2-3 machines did make it a full time job. Heck, they even developed robotic handling (*2). Again, the media price was more of a limiting factor (and readability) than time.
At a 'professional' level the danger for game companies was rather on the side of real CD manufacturing, as a standard CD manufacturing machine could be bought for less than some high-end PCs. The only costly part was acquiring the glass master.
*1 - Whoever could at that time cash out for a writer, would always also buy a simple reader that goes with it, so transfer can be done in a single run.
*2 - A good friend of mine was into this. He did the garage business for video tapes in the early 80s, and after some ... err ... troubles, slipped again into it with CDs. He had an awesome setup with two small robot arms handling the CDs of two drives connected to a single machine. That way he could have it run 24/7. He said it was good business, but I still think if he had invested the time it took to develop the software and handling mechanics in a start-up for robotics, he'd be a wealthy man by now. I just wish I had secured that machinery for my collection.
1
I don't recall the size of DVDs being much of a piracy deterrent. DVD writers came out less than a year after the DVD format was standardized, and hard drives large enough to hold one weren't unreasonably expensive. True, dual-layer recording took almost seven years to show up, but most software DVDs were single-layer, while video DVDs were transcoded to single-layer size (or more often, to 750MB or 800MB CD-ROM size).
– Mark
2 days ago
@Mark DVDs didn't have the size issue because you could just burn the files to a handful of blank CDs. CD burners were cheap by then, and DVD burners didn't take long to get cheap. Big difference from when CDROMs first became popular and your options were either 450 floppy disks to cover one CD, or CD burners that cost over $1K.
– mnem
yesterday
add a comment |
up vote
9
down vote
A quick review of the games consoles suggests that the Saturn and PlayStation were the first to implement copy protection as a firmware-level feature; between the 3DO, Mega CD and PC Engine there are some measures to ensure games are from licensed developers but no built-in protection against copies. I was also unable to find any evidence of software for those platforms implementing its own protection schemes.
So the answer seems to be: during the first wave of dedicated games hardware, no substantial effort was put into copy protection; one can guess that it just wasn't considered to be likely to be feasible within the usual commercial lifetime of a console prior to about 1994.
The most extreme example of this was the Dreamcast GD-ROM, which used a physically different format (two regions, one higher density, allowing up to 1TB per disc).
– fadden
9 hours ago
@fadden : Up to 1 GB per Gigabyte Disc Read-Only Memory" (technically called "GD-ROM"). Not one terabyte. Gigabyte.
– TOOGAM
7 hours ago
Although, ironically, isn't the Dreamcast the most recent console for which a hack was eventually found to run home-burnt games on an unmodified machine? Those that fit on a regular CD, at least.
– Tommy
6 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
8
down vote
In addition to Stephen Kitt's answer:
- Copy protection existed long before CDs. Many games that were shipped on floppies had copy protection - sometimes a question in the beginning that asked you to look at the booklet it came with, Monkey Island had a disk with 2 parts that you needed to set according to instructions to get the right answer.
- It was obviously much harder to distribute pirated copies then than it is now. The internet wasn't a thing so you were fairly limited in what you could acquire. Generally one of your friends had to actually buy the game. Sharing of games was fairly common, though.
New contributor
1
Monkey Island had "Dial A Pirate"!! I forgot all about that. 3.bp.blogspot.com/_FbFu1YBZ-Hw/TT-zIIDZAXI/AAAAAAAAAlk/…
– Jason Bray
2 days ago
Yep. was a great game all around.
– xyious
2 days ago
2
while true, this would be more appropriately made a comment than an answer since it's not really relevant to the question.
– peter ferrie
2 days ago
Funnily enough, many games had their copy protection removed when they were re-published on CD!
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
As to point 2, many bbs's back then were full of pirated games/apps (though the long distance charges could add up to the cost of the games). I haven't played games since then but I had assumed it was much harder to pirate now. Don't most of these games require an active connection to some game server, this "game as a service" model?
– Hasse1987
2 days ago
|
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up vote
7
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It's probably not exact but Sony back in the day had a really cool way of Protection against pirates:
Simply said they changed the CD itself... and made it "Wobble" in a certain way in the beginning so the reader knew it's an OEM Disk.
New contributor
make this a comment, but it's really cool idea.
– BasementJoe
2 days ago
2
@BasementJoe No, I think this is an answer to the question, and shouldn't be made a comment. It provides a way that CD-ROMs were protected against piracy. That's an answer!
– wizzwizz4♦
2 days ago
Sony got it from CD-R, a joint Philips and Sony spec, which uses this technique, called Absolute Time in Pregroove as a backwards compatible way of letting the drive know that a disc is writeable.
– user71659
2 days ago
FWIW, the disc doesn't physically wobble. For the ATIP, the spiral "groove" has a slight wobble that the read head can pick up. On a related note, some people asserted that the "black" plastic used on PlayStation games was part of the protection, but if you hold them up to the light you can see it's actually dark red, transparent to the IR laser. (cf. cdrfaq.org/faq03.html#S3-4, cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-24 )
– fadden
9 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
5
down vote
Besides the measures against copying the CD-ROM there were other things.
Pretty popular were dongles: specific hardware devices put one the parallel port. The game (or other software) did not run without those dongles. The dongles could not be copied easily.
New contributor
Well... You say that, but some of them were just dumb "wire this pin to that pin" that could be replicated with a filed paperclip.
– wizzwizz4♦
yesterday
How many games had dongles? I never came across one...
– Stephen Kitt
yesterday
2
@StephenKitt Dongles were more the purview of professional specialist software. Some still use dongles to this day!
– 520
17 hours ago
1
@520 I know what dongles are and where they are typically used ;-). I’m curious about specific mention of games in this answer.
– Stephen Kitt
17 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
From what I remember - most successful was the Serial Number approach when every CD copy had a unique hash to verify the unit copy. Verification process would request a hash to validate the copy and flag it useable. Serial number was included as a sticker inside the CD package.
New contributor
How would that work? CDs (as opposed to recordable CDs) are mastered, so each copy is identical, to within manufacturing defect limits, and there is no real opportunity to introduce uniqueness to the process. Reading a whole CD on a contemporary system would take on the order of half an hour; nobody (to within experimental error) would buy a game that takes half an hour, or even 15 minutes (assuming you had one of those fancy quad-speed drives) to start.
– a CVn
13 hours ago
Pressed CDs can't be serialized. In theory you can add a barcode in the disc hub, but most drives can't read it. You need to find a way to differentiate a pressed CD from a CD-R, which is possible, but doesn't involve a serial number.
– fadden
9 hours ago
The key for the software was included in the CD packaging as a sticker or printed on the paper. Verification was included in the software setup package, later online activation became more common.
– charlie137
8 hours ago
add a comment |
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8 Answers
8
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oldest
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8 Answers
8
active
oldest
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active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
67
down vote
accepted
When CD-ROM games were first introduced, game developers didn’t take any measures to prevent users from copying them, for two main reasons:
- CD-ROMs could contain more data than most hard drives at the time;
- CD writers were rare, and extremely expensive.
The Wikipedia page on CD-R gives some idea of the expense involved: in 1990, CD recording systems cost over $35,000; by 1992, that had dropped to around $10,000, and the $1,000 barrier was crossed in 1995.
In those days, a hard drive large enough to store a copy of a CD-ROM (assuming the latter was filled to capacity) cost a significant amount too ($2,000 in 1992) — and you’d need one, on a SCSI system, to have any chance of copying a CD correctly. Blank CDs were also quite expensive.
Another limiting factor initially was that CD writers wrote CDs at the nominal speed, so copying a full CD would take over an hour (not counting the time it took to read it).
Many CD games did however rely on some CD characteristics to make them harder to copy to another medium: they’d check that their CD was present, or rely on audio CD tracks.
17
@cup that depends on the tool you use to copy — copying a CD image doesn’t depend on the number of files it contains.
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
8
At the time I had my first CD writer around 1997, blank CD-R media was about £5 a piece. The occasional buffer underrun created very expensive drinks coasters.
– bodgit
2 days ago
1
For games whose "meaningful" size is small, an easy way to protect a CD-ROM would have been to fill the CD with many copies of the game's data, each encrypted somewhat differently, and have the game select among them at random. Not only would the sheer bulk of the files have been an impediment to someone copying them all, but such redundancy could also allow the game to be usable even if part of the disk got damaged.
– supercat
2 days ago
4
Yep, I remember my first CD writer in 1998 and it was the sort of thing where nobody had them and everyone ended up going to "that guy" who had one when they wanted things burned. It took 35 minutes to burn a disc and if anyone jumped in the room or your OS decided to take a crap instead of filling the write buffer you'd end up with a rather expensive coffee coaster.
– J...
2 days ago
1
Also, Internet connections were either not a thing at all or else far too slow to share a CD's worth of data.
– reirab
2 days ago
|
show 6 more comments
up vote
67
down vote
accepted
When CD-ROM games were first introduced, game developers didn’t take any measures to prevent users from copying them, for two main reasons:
- CD-ROMs could contain more data than most hard drives at the time;
- CD writers were rare, and extremely expensive.
The Wikipedia page on CD-R gives some idea of the expense involved: in 1990, CD recording systems cost over $35,000; by 1992, that had dropped to around $10,000, and the $1,000 barrier was crossed in 1995.
In those days, a hard drive large enough to store a copy of a CD-ROM (assuming the latter was filled to capacity) cost a significant amount too ($2,000 in 1992) — and you’d need one, on a SCSI system, to have any chance of copying a CD correctly. Blank CDs were also quite expensive.
Another limiting factor initially was that CD writers wrote CDs at the nominal speed, so copying a full CD would take over an hour (not counting the time it took to read it).
Many CD games did however rely on some CD characteristics to make them harder to copy to another medium: they’d check that their CD was present, or rely on audio CD tracks.
17
@cup that depends on the tool you use to copy — copying a CD image doesn’t depend on the number of files it contains.
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
8
At the time I had my first CD writer around 1997, blank CD-R media was about £5 a piece. The occasional buffer underrun created very expensive drinks coasters.
– bodgit
2 days ago
1
For games whose "meaningful" size is small, an easy way to protect a CD-ROM would have been to fill the CD with many copies of the game's data, each encrypted somewhat differently, and have the game select among them at random. Not only would the sheer bulk of the files have been an impediment to someone copying them all, but such redundancy could also allow the game to be usable even if part of the disk got damaged.
– supercat
2 days ago
4
Yep, I remember my first CD writer in 1998 and it was the sort of thing where nobody had them and everyone ended up going to "that guy" who had one when they wanted things burned. It took 35 minutes to burn a disc and if anyone jumped in the room or your OS decided to take a crap instead of filling the write buffer you'd end up with a rather expensive coffee coaster.
– J...
2 days ago
1
Also, Internet connections were either not a thing at all or else far too slow to share a CD's worth of data.
– reirab
2 days ago
|
show 6 more comments
up vote
67
down vote
accepted
up vote
67
down vote
accepted
When CD-ROM games were first introduced, game developers didn’t take any measures to prevent users from copying them, for two main reasons:
- CD-ROMs could contain more data than most hard drives at the time;
- CD writers were rare, and extremely expensive.
The Wikipedia page on CD-R gives some idea of the expense involved: in 1990, CD recording systems cost over $35,000; by 1992, that had dropped to around $10,000, and the $1,000 barrier was crossed in 1995.
In those days, a hard drive large enough to store a copy of a CD-ROM (assuming the latter was filled to capacity) cost a significant amount too ($2,000 in 1992) — and you’d need one, on a SCSI system, to have any chance of copying a CD correctly. Blank CDs were also quite expensive.
Another limiting factor initially was that CD writers wrote CDs at the nominal speed, so copying a full CD would take over an hour (not counting the time it took to read it).
Many CD games did however rely on some CD characteristics to make them harder to copy to another medium: they’d check that their CD was present, or rely on audio CD tracks.
When CD-ROM games were first introduced, game developers didn’t take any measures to prevent users from copying them, for two main reasons:
- CD-ROMs could contain more data than most hard drives at the time;
- CD writers were rare, and extremely expensive.
The Wikipedia page on CD-R gives some idea of the expense involved: in 1990, CD recording systems cost over $35,000; by 1992, that had dropped to around $10,000, and the $1,000 barrier was crossed in 1995.
In those days, a hard drive large enough to store a copy of a CD-ROM (assuming the latter was filled to capacity) cost a significant amount too ($2,000 in 1992) — and you’d need one, on a SCSI system, to have any chance of copying a CD correctly. Blank CDs were also quite expensive.
Another limiting factor initially was that CD writers wrote CDs at the nominal speed, so copying a full CD would take over an hour (not counting the time it took to read it).
Many CD games did however rely on some CD characteristics to make them harder to copy to another medium: they’d check that their CD was present, or rely on audio CD tracks.
edited yesterday
answered 2 days ago
Stephen Kitt
34.3k4143156
34.3k4143156
17
@cup that depends on the tool you use to copy — copying a CD image doesn’t depend on the number of files it contains.
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
8
At the time I had my first CD writer around 1997, blank CD-R media was about £5 a piece. The occasional buffer underrun created very expensive drinks coasters.
– bodgit
2 days ago
1
For games whose "meaningful" size is small, an easy way to protect a CD-ROM would have been to fill the CD with many copies of the game's data, each encrypted somewhat differently, and have the game select among them at random. Not only would the sheer bulk of the files have been an impediment to someone copying them all, but such redundancy could also allow the game to be usable even if part of the disk got damaged.
– supercat
2 days ago
4
Yep, I remember my first CD writer in 1998 and it was the sort of thing where nobody had them and everyone ended up going to "that guy" who had one when they wanted things burned. It took 35 minutes to burn a disc and if anyone jumped in the room or your OS decided to take a crap instead of filling the write buffer you'd end up with a rather expensive coffee coaster.
– J...
2 days ago
1
Also, Internet connections were either not a thing at all or else far too slow to share a CD's worth of data.
– reirab
2 days ago
|
show 6 more comments
17
@cup that depends on the tool you use to copy — copying a CD image doesn’t depend on the number of files it contains.
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
8
At the time I had my first CD writer around 1997, blank CD-R media was about £5 a piece. The occasional buffer underrun created very expensive drinks coasters.
– bodgit
2 days ago
1
For games whose "meaningful" size is small, an easy way to protect a CD-ROM would have been to fill the CD with many copies of the game's data, each encrypted somewhat differently, and have the game select among them at random. Not only would the sheer bulk of the files have been an impediment to someone copying them all, but such redundancy could also allow the game to be usable even if part of the disk got damaged.
– supercat
2 days ago
4
Yep, I remember my first CD writer in 1998 and it was the sort of thing where nobody had them and everyone ended up going to "that guy" who had one when they wanted things burned. It took 35 minutes to burn a disc and if anyone jumped in the room or your OS decided to take a crap instead of filling the write buffer you'd end up with a rather expensive coffee coaster.
– J...
2 days ago
1
Also, Internet connections were either not a thing at all or else far too slow to share a CD's worth of data.
– reirab
2 days ago
17
17
@cup that depends on the tool you use to copy — copying a CD image doesn’t depend on the number of files it contains.
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
@cup that depends on the tool you use to copy — copying a CD image doesn’t depend on the number of files it contains.
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
8
8
At the time I had my first CD writer around 1997, blank CD-R media was about £5 a piece. The occasional buffer underrun created very expensive drinks coasters.
– bodgit
2 days ago
At the time I had my first CD writer around 1997, blank CD-R media was about £5 a piece. The occasional buffer underrun created very expensive drinks coasters.
– bodgit
2 days ago
1
1
For games whose "meaningful" size is small, an easy way to protect a CD-ROM would have been to fill the CD with many copies of the game's data, each encrypted somewhat differently, and have the game select among them at random. Not only would the sheer bulk of the files have been an impediment to someone copying them all, but such redundancy could also allow the game to be usable even if part of the disk got damaged.
– supercat
2 days ago
For games whose "meaningful" size is small, an easy way to protect a CD-ROM would have been to fill the CD with many copies of the game's data, each encrypted somewhat differently, and have the game select among them at random. Not only would the sheer bulk of the files have been an impediment to someone copying them all, but such redundancy could also allow the game to be usable even if part of the disk got damaged.
– supercat
2 days ago
4
4
Yep, I remember my first CD writer in 1998 and it was the sort of thing where nobody had them and everyone ended up going to "that guy" who had one when they wanted things burned. It took 35 minutes to burn a disc and if anyone jumped in the room or your OS decided to take a crap instead of filling the write buffer you'd end up with a rather expensive coffee coaster.
– J...
2 days ago
Yep, I remember my first CD writer in 1998 and it was the sort of thing where nobody had them and everyone ended up going to "that guy" who had one when they wanted things burned. It took 35 minutes to burn a disc and if anyone jumped in the room or your OS decided to take a crap instead of filling the write buffer you'd end up with a rather expensive coffee coaster.
– J...
2 days ago
1
1
Also, Internet connections were either not a thing at all or else far too slow to share a CD's worth of data.
– reirab
2 days ago
Also, Internet connections were either not a thing at all or else far too slow to share a CD's worth of data.
– reirab
2 days ago
|
show 6 more comments
up vote
27
down vote
We had some software delivered on a CD in which the vendor purposely put a defect on a specific track. If that defect wasn't there, the software could say it wasn't an original CD.
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
New contributor
10
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
Though only until HDD capacity caught up. Then software drivers to emulate CD drives and create disc images, including the defects, started showing up.
– jmbpiano
yesterday
2
What first started copying the defects that @jmbpiano mentions, I wonder? I remember using Alcohol 120% or, was it DaemonTools?, in mid 2000s for that. Would that be on topic here?
– muru
yesterday
2
On a specific track? I assume you mean on a specific sector, because data on a CD is arranged in a single spiral track.
– kasperd
yesterday
I seem to remember the discs for the original Playstation had these defects, and one of the programs that could copy those defects was Nero Burning ROM.
– pacoverflow
15 hours ago
Some defects can be copied, some can't; it depends on the drive. The trouble for the people creating the protection schemes is that some defects (notably those that are expected to return different data when re-read) are handled differently by different drives, so some schemes risk locking out legitimate users. The fancy virtual CD drivers that emulated defects made this obsolete.
– fadden
9 hours ago
|
show 1 more comment
up vote
27
down vote
We had some software delivered on a CD in which the vendor purposely put a defect on a specific track. If that defect wasn't there, the software could say it wasn't an original CD.
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
New contributor
10
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
Though only until HDD capacity caught up. Then software drivers to emulate CD drives and create disc images, including the defects, started showing up.
– jmbpiano
yesterday
2
What first started copying the defects that @jmbpiano mentions, I wonder? I remember using Alcohol 120% or, was it DaemonTools?, in mid 2000s for that. Would that be on topic here?
– muru
yesterday
2
On a specific track? I assume you mean on a specific sector, because data on a CD is arranged in a single spiral track.
– kasperd
yesterday
I seem to remember the discs for the original Playstation had these defects, and one of the programs that could copy those defects was Nero Burning ROM.
– pacoverflow
15 hours ago
Some defects can be copied, some can't; it depends on the drive. The trouble for the people creating the protection schemes is that some defects (notably those that are expected to return different data when re-read) are handled differently by different drives, so some schemes risk locking out legitimate users. The fancy virtual CD drivers that emulated defects made this obsolete.
– fadden
9 hours ago
|
show 1 more comment
up vote
27
down vote
up vote
27
down vote
We had some software delivered on a CD in which the vendor purposely put a defect on a specific track. If that defect wasn't there, the software could say it wasn't an original CD.
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
New contributor
We had some software delivered on a CD in which the vendor purposely put a defect on a specific track. If that defect wasn't there, the software could say it wasn't an original CD.
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
New contributor
edited yesterday
RonJohn
24515
24515
New contributor
answered 2 days ago
RodH
27912
27912
New contributor
New contributor
10
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
Though only until HDD capacity caught up. Then software drivers to emulate CD drives and create disc images, including the defects, started showing up.
– jmbpiano
yesterday
2
What first started copying the defects that @jmbpiano mentions, I wonder? I remember using Alcohol 120% or, was it DaemonTools?, in mid 2000s for that. Would that be on topic here?
– muru
yesterday
2
On a specific track? I assume you mean on a specific sector, because data on a CD is arranged in a single spiral track.
– kasperd
yesterday
I seem to remember the discs for the original Playstation had these defects, and one of the programs that could copy those defects was Nero Burning ROM.
– pacoverflow
15 hours ago
Some defects can be copied, some can't; it depends on the drive. The trouble for the people creating the protection schemes is that some defects (notably those that are expected to return different data when re-read) are handled differently by different drives, so some schemes risk locking out legitimate users. The fancy virtual CD drivers that emulated defects made this obsolete.
– fadden
9 hours ago
|
show 1 more comment
10
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
Though only until HDD capacity caught up. Then software drivers to emulate CD drives and create disc images, including the defects, started showing up.
– jmbpiano
yesterday
2
What first started copying the defects that @jmbpiano mentions, I wonder? I remember using Alcohol 120% or, was it DaemonTools?, in mid 2000s for that. Would that be on topic here?
– muru
yesterday
2
On a specific track? I assume you mean on a specific sector, because data on a CD is arranged in a single spiral track.
– kasperd
yesterday
I seem to remember the discs for the original Playstation had these defects, and one of the programs that could copy those defects was Nero Burning ROM.
– pacoverflow
15 hours ago
Some defects can be copied, some can't; it depends on the drive. The trouble for the people creating the protection schemes is that some defects (notably those that are expected to return different data when re-read) are handled differently by different drives, so some schemes risk locking out legitimate users. The fancy virtual CD drivers that emulated defects made this obsolete.
– fadden
9 hours ago
10
10
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
Though only until HDD capacity caught up. Then software drivers to emulate CD drives and create disc images, including the defects, started showing up.– jmbpiano
yesterday
Since defects are not copied, even on low level track copies, an exact replica could not be created.
Though only until HDD capacity caught up. Then software drivers to emulate CD drives and create disc images, including the defects, started showing up.– jmbpiano
yesterday
2
2
What first started copying the defects that @jmbpiano mentions, I wonder? I remember using Alcohol 120% or, was it DaemonTools?, in mid 2000s for that. Would that be on topic here?
– muru
yesterday
What first started copying the defects that @jmbpiano mentions, I wonder? I remember using Alcohol 120% or, was it DaemonTools?, in mid 2000s for that. Would that be on topic here?
– muru
yesterday
2
2
On a specific track? I assume you mean on a specific sector, because data on a CD is arranged in a single spiral track.
– kasperd
yesterday
On a specific track? I assume you mean on a specific sector, because data on a CD is arranged in a single spiral track.
– kasperd
yesterday
I seem to remember the discs for the original Playstation had these defects, and one of the programs that could copy those defects was Nero Burning ROM.
– pacoverflow
15 hours ago
I seem to remember the discs for the original Playstation had these defects, and one of the programs that could copy those defects was Nero Burning ROM.
– pacoverflow
15 hours ago
Some defects can be copied, some can't; it depends on the drive. The trouble for the people creating the protection schemes is that some defects (notably those that are expected to return different data when re-read) are handled differently by different drives, so some schemes risk locking out legitimate users. The fancy virtual CD drivers that emulated defects made this obsolete.
– fadden
9 hours ago
Some defects can be copied, some can't; it depends on the drive. The trouble for the people creating the protection schemes is that some defects (notably those that are expected to return different data when re-read) are handled differently by different drives, so some schemes risk locking out legitimate users. The fancy virtual CD drivers that emulated defects made this obsolete.
– fadden
9 hours ago
|
show 1 more comment
up vote
15
down vote
(preface: While Stephen's answer already covers the basic points, I would like to put a different emphasis here - and merge in some private history :))
Short answer:
It was the game's size and the need to copy it to a CD again, combined with expensive and unreliable writers. Further, the CD itself was used as a copy protection. While games often got installed completely onto HD, they did check every now and then if the CD was still present in a drive connected, so people could not install and run it on multiple (friends') systems.
All of this is based around the fact, that copying CDs was expensive and unreliable - at least until the early 2000s.
In general, it's a bit like it was with floppies in the very beginning (my fist 10-pack did cost me 80 Marks), where copying to tape was prohibitive, just to be repeated in the mid 2000s when DVDs where rolled out when CD writing became cheap and reliable.
The Long Read
To start with, CD production was, at that time mostly confined to 'real' CDs and in a factory setup, as writeables not only where prohibitively expensive, but also did not always produce a result readable on (cheap) CD-ROM drives. When looking at prices it may be helpful to see that CDs weren't a thing for computer users until 1991's Soundblaster Pro got sold with a special interface for the Mitsumi CD Drive (and often packaged with one). Keep in mind this is about games. Here only mass market counts, not some high power users like many of us may have been.
CD as a game medium only started after that. At this time their sheer size was the most relevant copy protection. Game companies where often accused of adding unnecessary content to explicitly bloat the size of data used - including lots of clips and cut scenes together with purposely non-compressed data, to make it hard to copy games onto disks. In fact, numerous game reviews did test games that where delivered as a 'basic version' on floppies as well as their 'enhanced' CD counterpart and found that the CD-version didn't add anything useful.
While the cost for a CD writer in the mid-90s dropped close to 1000 USD, that's still above the usual juvenile threshold. And writers still suffered from compatibility issues with regular (cheap) players. Even if daddy did invest in the son's future by buying a PC with a well-fitted SCSI based machine including a writer, media prices were comparably high. When bought as a 25 pack, a single writeable CD was close to 10 USD. Thus copying did still bear high cost.
The time argument doesn't matter so much on the hobbyist side, as waiting an hour for the CD to complete (*1) could be filled with whatever teenagers do anyway :))
It doesn't matter on a 'professional' scale as well. Just remember all the copying that was going on during early 80s with pirated video tapes. People had a dozen VCRs in their garage, hooked up to a 'Master' and copied in real time. More or less the same way with CDs in the mid to late 90s. Machines did run multiple drives at once, just this time the master was a hard disk. 8-12 drives per machine and 2-3 machines did make it a full time job. Heck, they even developed robotic handling (*2). Again, the media price was more of a limiting factor (and readability) than time.
At a 'professional' level the danger for game companies was rather on the side of real CD manufacturing, as a standard CD manufacturing machine could be bought for less than some high-end PCs. The only costly part was acquiring the glass master.
*1 - Whoever could at that time cash out for a writer, would always also buy a simple reader that goes with it, so transfer can be done in a single run.
*2 - A good friend of mine was into this. He did the garage business for video tapes in the early 80s, and after some ... err ... troubles, slipped again into it with CDs. He had an awesome setup with two small robot arms handling the CDs of two drives connected to a single machine. That way he could have it run 24/7. He said it was good business, but I still think if he had invested the time it took to develop the software and handling mechanics in a start-up for robotics, he'd be a wealthy man by now. I just wish I had secured that machinery for my collection.
1
I don't recall the size of DVDs being much of a piracy deterrent. DVD writers came out less than a year after the DVD format was standardized, and hard drives large enough to hold one weren't unreasonably expensive. True, dual-layer recording took almost seven years to show up, but most software DVDs were single-layer, while video DVDs were transcoded to single-layer size (or more often, to 750MB or 800MB CD-ROM size).
– Mark
2 days ago
@Mark DVDs didn't have the size issue because you could just burn the files to a handful of blank CDs. CD burners were cheap by then, and DVD burners didn't take long to get cheap. Big difference from when CDROMs first became popular and your options were either 450 floppy disks to cover one CD, or CD burners that cost over $1K.
– mnem
yesterday
add a comment |
up vote
15
down vote
(preface: While Stephen's answer already covers the basic points, I would like to put a different emphasis here - and merge in some private history :))
Short answer:
It was the game's size and the need to copy it to a CD again, combined with expensive and unreliable writers. Further, the CD itself was used as a copy protection. While games often got installed completely onto HD, they did check every now and then if the CD was still present in a drive connected, so people could not install and run it on multiple (friends') systems.
All of this is based around the fact, that copying CDs was expensive and unreliable - at least until the early 2000s.
In general, it's a bit like it was with floppies in the very beginning (my fist 10-pack did cost me 80 Marks), where copying to tape was prohibitive, just to be repeated in the mid 2000s when DVDs where rolled out when CD writing became cheap and reliable.
The Long Read
To start with, CD production was, at that time mostly confined to 'real' CDs and in a factory setup, as writeables not only where prohibitively expensive, but also did not always produce a result readable on (cheap) CD-ROM drives. When looking at prices it may be helpful to see that CDs weren't a thing for computer users until 1991's Soundblaster Pro got sold with a special interface for the Mitsumi CD Drive (and often packaged with one). Keep in mind this is about games. Here only mass market counts, not some high power users like many of us may have been.
CD as a game medium only started after that. At this time their sheer size was the most relevant copy protection. Game companies where often accused of adding unnecessary content to explicitly bloat the size of data used - including lots of clips and cut scenes together with purposely non-compressed data, to make it hard to copy games onto disks. In fact, numerous game reviews did test games that where delivered as a 'basic version' on floppies as well as their 'enhanced' CD counterpart and found that the CD-version didn't add anything useful.
While the cost for a CD writer in the mid-90s dropped close to 1000 USD, that's still above the usual juvenile threshold. And writers still suffered from compatibility issues with regular (cheap) players. Even if daddy did invest in the son's future by buying a PC with a well-fitted SCSI based machine including a writer, media prices were comparably high. When bought as a 25 pack, a single writeable CD was close to 10 USD. Thus copying did still bear high cost.
The time argument doesn't matter so much on the hobbyist side, as waiting an hour for the CD to complete (*1) could be filled with whatever teenagers do anyway :))
It doesn't matter on a 'professional' scale as well. Just remember all the copying that was going on during early 80s with pirated video tapes. People had a dozen VCRs in their garage, hooked up to a 'Master' and copied in real time. More or less the same way with CDs in the mid to late 90s. Machines did run multiple drives at once, just this time the master was a hard disk. 8-12 drives per machine and 2-3 machines did make it a full time job. Heck, they even developed robotic handling (*2). Again, the media price was more of a limiting factor (and readability) than time.
At a 'professional' level the danger for game companies was rather on the side of real CD manufacturing, as a standard CD manufacturing machine could be bought for less than some high-end PCs. The only costly part was acquiring the glass master.
*1 - Whoever could at that time cash out for a writer, would always also buy a simple reader that goes with it, so transfer can be done in a single run.
*2 - A good friend of mine was into this. He did the garage business for video tapes in the early 80s, and after some ... err ... troubles, slipped again into it with CDs. He had an awesome setup with two small robot arms handling the CDs of two drives connected to a single machine. That way he could have it run 24/7. He said it was good business, but I still think if he had invested the time it took to develop the software and handling mechanics in a start-up for robotics, he'd be a wealthy man by now. I just wish I had secured that machinery for my collection.
1
I don't recall the size of DVDs being much of a piracy deterrent. DVD writers came out less than a year after the DVD format was standardized, and hard drives large enough to hold one weren't unreasonably expensive. True, dual-layer recording took almost seven years to show up, but most software DVDs were single-layer, while video DVDs were transcoded to single-layer size (or more often, to 750MB or 800MB CD-ROM size).
– Mark
2 days ago
@Mark DVDs didn't have the size issue because you could just burn the files to a handful of blank CDs. CD burners were cheap by then, and DVD burners didn't take long to get cheap. Big difference from when CDROMs first became popular and your options were either 450 floppy disks to cover one CD, or CD burners that cost over $1K.
– mnem
yesterday
add a comment |
up vote
15
down vote
up vote
15
down vote
(preface: While Stephen's answer already covers the basic points, I would like to put a different emphasis here - and merge in some private history :))
Short answer:
It was the game's size and the need to copy it to a CD again, combined with expensive and unreliable writers. Further, the CD itself was used as a copy protection. While games often got installed completely onto HD, they did check every now and then if the CD was still present in a drive connected, so people could not install and run it on multiple (friends') systems.
All of this is based around the fact, that copying CDs was expensive and unreliable - at least until the early 2000s.
In general, it's a bit like it was with floppies in the very beginning (my fist 10-pack did cost me 80 Marks), where copying to tape was prohibitive, just to be repeated in the mid 2000s when DVDs where rolled out when CD writing became cheap and reliable.
The Long Read
To start with, CD production was, at that time mostly confined to 'real' CDs and in a factory setup, as writeables not only where prohibitively expensive, but also did not always produce a result readable on (cheap) CD-ROM drives. When looking at prices it may be helpful to see that CDs weren't a thing for computer users until 1991's Soundblaster Pro got sold with a special interface for the Mitsumi CD Drive (and often packaged with one). Keep in mind this is about games. Here only mass market counts, not some high power users like many of us may have been.
CD as a game medium only started after that. At this time their sheer size was the most relevant copy protection. Game companies where often accused of adding unnecessary content to explicitly bloat the size of data used - including lots of clips and cut scenes together with purposely non-compressed data, to make it hard to copy games onto disks. In fact, numerous game reviews did test games that where delivered as a 'basic version' on floppies as well as their 'enhanced' CD counterpart and found that the CD-version didn't add anything useful.
While the cost for a CD writer in the mid-90s dropped close to 1000 USD, that's still above the usual juvenile threshold. And writers still suffered from compatibility issues with regular (cheap) players. Even if daddy did invest in the son's future by buying a PC with a well-fitted SCSI based machine including a writer, media prices were comparably high. When bought as a 25 pack, a single writeable CD was close to 10 USD. Thus copying did still bear high cost.
The time argument doesn't matter so much on the hobbyist side, as waiting an hour for the CD to complete (*1) could be filled with whatever teenagers do anyway :))
It doesn't matter on a 'professional' scale as well. Just remember all the copying that was going on during early 80s with pirated video tapes. People had a dozen VCRs in their garage, hooked up to a 'Master' and copied in real time. More or less the same way with CDs in the mid to late 90s. Machines did run multiple drives at once, just this time the master was a hard disk. 8-12 drives per machine and 2-3 machines did make it a full time job. Heck, they even developed robotic handling (*2). Again, the media price was more of a limiting factor (and readability) than time.
At a 'professional' level the danger for game companies was rather on the side of real CD manufacturing, as a standard CD manufacturing machine could be bought for less than some high-end PCs. The only costly part was acquiring the glass master.
*1 - Whoever could at that time cash out for a writer, would always also buy a simple reader that goes with it, so transfer can be done in a single run.
*2 - A good friend of mine was into this. He did the garage business for video tapes in the early 80s, and after some ... err ... troubles, slipped again into it with CDs. He had an awesome setup with two small robot arms handling the CDs of two drives connected to a single machine. That way he could have it run 24/7. He said it was good business, but I still think if he had invested the time it took to develop the software and handling mechanics in a start-up for robotics, he'd be a wealthy man by now. I just wish I had secured that machinery for my collection.
(preface: While Stephen's answer already covers the basic points, I would like to put a different emphasis here - and merge in some private history :))
Short answer:
It was the game's size and the need to copy it to a CD again, combined with expensive and unreliable writers. Further, the CD itself was used as a copy protection. While games often got installed completely onto HD, they did check every now and then if the CD was still present in a drive connected, so people could not install and run it on multiple (friends') systems.
All of this is based around the fact, that copying CDs was expensive and unreliable - at least until the early 2000s.
In general, it's a bit like it was with floppies in the very beginning (my fist 10-pack did cost me 80 Marks), where copying to tape was prohibitive, just to be repeated in the mid 2000s when DVDs where rolled out when CD writing became cheap and reliable.
The Long Read
To start with, CD production was, at that time mostly confined to 'real' CDs and in a factory setup, as writeables not only where prohibitively expensive, but also did not always produce a result readable on (cheap) CD-ROM drives. When looking at prices it may be helpful to see that CDs weren't a thing for computer users until 1991's Soundblaster Pro got sold with a special interface for the Mitsumi CD Drive (and often packaged with one). Keep in mind this is about games. Here only mass market counts, not some high power users like many of us may have been.
CD as a game medium only started after that. At this time their sheer size was the most relevant copy protection. Game companies where often accused of adding unnecessary content to explicitly bloat the size of data used - including lots of clips and cut scenes together with purposely non-compressed data, to make it hard to copy games onto disks. In fact, numerous game reviews did test games that where delivered as a 'basic version' on floppies as well as their 'enhanced' CD counterpart and found that the CD-version didn't add anything useful.
While the cost for a CD writer in the mid-90s dropped close to 1000 USD, that's still above the usual juvenile threshold. And writers still suffered from compatibility issues with regular (cheap) players. Even if daddy did invest in the son's future by buying a PC with a well-fitted SCSI based machine including a writer, media prices were comparably high. When bought as a 25 pack, a single writeable CD was close to 10 USD. Thus copying did still bear high cost.
The time argument doesn't matter so much on the hobbyist side, as waiting an hour for the CD to complete (*1) could be filled with whatever teenagers do anyway :))
It doesn't matter on a 'professional' scale as well. Just remember all the copying that was going on during early 80s with pirated video tapes. People had a dozen VCRs in their garage, hooked up to a 'Master' and copied in real time. More or less the same way with CDs in the mid to late 90s. Machines did run multiple drives at once, just this time the master was a hard disk. 8-12 drives per machine and 2-3 machines did make it a full time job. Heck, they even developed robotic handling (*2). Again, the media price was more of a limiting factor (and readability) than time.
At a 'professional' level the danger for game companies was rather on the side of real CD manufacturing, as a standard CD manufacturing machine could be bought for less than some high-end PCs. The only costly part was acquiring the glass master.
*1 - Whoever could at that time cash out for a writer, would always also buy a simple reader that goes with it, so transfer can be done in a single run.
*2 - A good friend of mine was into this. He did the garage business for video tapes in the early 80s, and after some ... err ... troubles, slipped again into it with CDs. He had an awesome setup with two small robot arms handling the CDs of two drives connected to a single machine. That way he could have it run 24/7. He said it was good business, but I still think if he had invested the time it took to develop the software and handling mechanics in a start-up for robotics, he'd be a wealthy man by now. I just wish I had secured that machinery for my collection.
edited yesterday
LangLangC
193118
193118
answered 2 days ago
Raffzahn
43.4k599175
43.4k599175
1
I don't recall the size of DVDs being much of a piracy deterrent. DVD writers came out less than a year after the DVD format was standardized, and hard drives large enough to hold one weren't unreasonably expensive. True, dual-layer recording took almost seven years to show up, but most software DVDs were single-layer, while video DVDs were transcoded to single-layer size (or more often, to 750MB or 800MB CD-ROM size).
– Mark
2 days ago
@Mark DVDs didn't have the size issue because you could just burn the files to a handful of blank CDs. CD burners were cheap by then, and DVD burners didn't take long to get cheap. Big difference from when CDROMs first became popular and your options were either 450 floppy disks to cover one CD, or CD burners that cost over $1K.
– mnem
yesterday
add a comment |
1
I don't recall the size of DVDs being much of a piracy deterrent. DVD writers came out less than a year after the DVD format was standardized, and hard drives large enough to hold one weren't unreasonably expensive. True, dual-layer recording took almost seven years to show up, but most software DVDs were single-layer, while video DVDs were transcoded to single-layer size (or more often, to 750MB or 800MB CD-ROM size).
– Mark
2 days ago
@Mark DVDs didn't have the size issue because you could just burn the files to a handful of blank CDs. CD burners were cheap by then, and DVD burners didn't take long to get cheap. Big difference from when CDROMs first became popular and your options were either 450 floppy disks to cover one CD, or CD burners that cost over $1K.
– mnem
yesterday
1
1
I don't recall the size of DVDs being much of a piracy deterrent. DVD writers came out less than a year after the DVD format was standardized, and hard drives large enough to hold one weren't unreasonably expensive. True, dual-layer recording took almost seven years to show up, but most software DVDs were single-layer, while video DVDs were transcoded to single-layer size (or more often, to 750MB or 800MB CD-ROM size).
– Mark
2 days ago
I don't recall the size of DVDs being much of a piracy deterrent. DVD writers came out less than a year after the DVD format was standardized, and hard drives large enough to hold one weren't unreasonably expensive. True, dual-layer recording took almost seven years to show up, but most software DVDs were single-layer, while video DVDs were transcoded to single-layer size (or more often, to 750MB or 800MB CD-ROM size).
– Mark
2 days ago
@Mark DVDs didn't have the size issue because you could just burn the files to a handful of blank CDs. CD burners were cheap by then, and DVD burners didn't take long to get cheap. Big difference from when CDROMs first became popular and your options were either 450 floppy disks to cover one CD, or CD burners that cost over $1K.
– mnem
yesterday
@Mark DVDs didn't have the size issue because you could just burn the files to a handful of blank CDs. CD burners were cheap by then, and DVD burners didn't take long to get cheap. Big difference from when CDROMs first became popular and your options were either 450 floppy disks to cover one CD, or CD burners that cost over $1K.
– mnem
yesterday
add a comment |
up vote
9
down vote
A quick review of the games consoles suggests that the Saturn and PlayStation were the first to implement copy protection as a firmware-level feature; between the 3DO, Mega CD and PC Engine there are some measures to ensure games are from licensed developers but no built-in protection against copies. I was also unable to find any evidence of software for those platforms implementing its own protection schemes.
So the answer seems to be: during the first wave of dedicated games hardware, no substantial effort was put into copy protection; one can guess that it just wasn't considered to be likely to be feasible within the usual commercial lifetime of a console prior to about 1994.
The most extreme example of this was the Dreamcast GD-ROM, which used a physically different format (two regions, one higher density, allowing up to 1TB per disc).
– fadden
9 hours ago
@fadden : Up to 1 GB per Gigabyte Disc Read-Only Memory" (technically called "GD-ROM"). Not one terabyte. Gigabyte.
– TOOGAM
7 hours ago
Although, ironically, isn't the Dreamcast the most recent console for which a hack was eventually found to run home-burnt games on an unmodified machine? Those that fit on a regular CD, at least.
– Tommy
6 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
9
down vote
A quick review of the games consoles suggests that the Saturn and PlayStation were the first to implement copy protection as a firmware-level feature; between the 3DO, Mega CD and PC Engine there are some measures to ensure games are from licensed developers but no built-in protection against copies. I was also unable to find any evidence of software for those platforms implementing its own protection schemes.
So the answer seems to be: during the first wave of dedicated games hardware, no substantial effort was put into copy protection; one can guess that it just wasn't considered to be likely to be feasible within the usual commercial lifetime of a console prior to about 1994.
The most extreme example of this was the Dreamcast GD-ROM, which used a physically different format (two regions, one higher density, allowing up to 1TB per disc).
– fadden
9 hours ago
@fadden : Up to 1 GB per Gigabyte Disc Read-Only Memory" (technically called "GD-ROM"). Not one terabyte. Gigabyte.
– TOOGAM
7 hours ago
Although, ironically, isn't the Dreamcast the most recent console for which a hack was eventually found to run home-burnt games on an unmodified machine? Those that fit on a regular CD, at least.
– Tommy
6 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
9
down vote
up vote
9
down vote
A quick review of the games consoles suggests that the Saturn and PlayStation were the first to implement copy protection as a firmware-level feature; between the 3DO, Mega CD and PC Engine there are some measures to ensure games are from licensed developers but no built-in protection against copies. I was also unable to find any evidence of software for those platforms implementing its own protection schemes.
So the answer seems to be: during the first wave of dedicated games hardware, no substantial effort was put into copy protection; one can guess that it just wasn't considered to be likely to be feasible within the usual commercial lifetime of a console prior to about 1994.
A quick review of the games consoles suggests that the Saturn and PlayStation were the first to implement copy protection as a firmware-level feature; between the 3DO, Mega CD and PC Engine there are some measures to ensure games are from licensed developers but no built-in protection against copies. I was also unable to find any evidence of software for those platforms implementing its own protection schemes.
So the answer seems to be: during the first wave of dedicated games hardware, no substantial effort was put into copy protection; one can guess that it just wasn't considered to be likely to be feasible within the usual commercial lifetime of a console prior to about 1994.
edited 17 hours ago
mrkotfw
31
31
answered 2 days ago
Tommy
13.5k13466
13.5k13466
The most extreme example of this was the Dreamcast GD-ROM, which used a physically different format (two regions, one higher density, allowing up to 1TB per disc).
– fadden
9 hours ago
@fadden : Up to 1 GB per Gigabyte Disc Read-Only Memory" (technically called "GD-ROM"). Not one terabyte. Gigabyte.
– TOOGAM
7 hours ago
Although, ironically, isn't the Dreamcast the most recent console for which a hack was eventually found to run home-burnt games on an unmodified machine? Those that fit on a regular CD, at least.
– Tommy
6 hours ago
add a comment |
The most extreme example of this was the Dreamcast GD-ROM, which used a physically different format (two regions, one higher density, allowing up to 1TB per disc).
– fadden
9 hours ago
@fadden : Up to 1 GB per Gigabyte Disc Read-Only Memory" (technically called "GD-ROM"). Not one terabyte. Gigabyte.
– TOOGAM
7 hours ago
Although, ironically, isn't the Dreamcast the most recent console for which a hack was eventually found to run home-burnt games on an unmodified machine? Those that fit on a regular CD, at least.
– Tommy
6 hours ago
The most extreme example of this was the Dreamcast GD-ROM, which used a physically different format (two regions, one higher density, allowing up to 1TB per disc).
– fadden
9 hours ago
The most extreme example of this was the Dreamcast GD-ROM, which used a physically different format (two regions, one higher density, allowing up to 1TB per disc).
– fadden
9 hours ago
@fadden : Up to 1 GB per Gigabyte Disc Read-Only Memory" (technically called "GD-ROM"). Not one terabyte. Gigabyte.
– TOOGAM
7 hours ago
@fadden : Up to 1 GB per Gigabyte Disc Read-Only Memory" (technically called "GD-ROM"). Not one terabyte. Gigabyte.
– TOOGAM
7 hours ago
Although, ironically, isn't the Dreamcast the most recent console for which a hack was eventually found to run home-burnt games on an unmodified machine? Those that fit on a regular CD, at least.
– Tommy
6 hours ago
Although, ironically, isn't the Dreamcast the most recent console for which a hack was eventually found to run home-burnt games on an unmodified machine? Those that fit on a regular CD, at least.
– Tommy
6 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
8
down vote
In addition to Stephen Kitt's answer:
- Copy protection existed long before CDs. Many games that were shipped on floppies had copy protection - sometimes a question in the beginning that asked you to look at the booklet it came with, Monkey Island had a disk with 2 parts that you needed to set according to instructions to get the right answer.
- It was obviously much harder to distribute pirated copies then than it is now. The internet wasn't a thing so you were fairly limited in what you could acquire. Generally one of your friends had to actually buy the game. Sharing of games was fairly common, though.
New contributor
1
Monkey Island had "Dial A Pirate"!! I forgot all about that. 3.bp.blogspot.com/_FbFu1YBZ-Hw/TT-zIIDZAXI/AAAAAAAAAlk/…
– Jason Bray
2 days ago
Yep. was a great game all around.
– xyious
2 days ago
2
while true, this would be more appropriately made a comment than an answer since it's not really relevant to the question.
– peter ferrie
2 days ago
Funnily enough, many games had their copy protection removed when they were re-published on CD!
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
As to point 2, many bbs's back then were full of pirated games/apps (though the long distance charges could add up to the cost of the games). I haven't played games since then but I had assumed it was much harder to pirate now. Don't most of these games require an active connection to some game server, this "game as a service" model?
– Hasse1987
2 days ago
|
show 1 more comment
up vote
8
down vote
In addition to Stephen Kitt's answer:
- Copy protection existed long before CDs. Many games that were shipped on floppies had copy protection - sometimes a question in the beginning that asked you to look at the booklet it came with, Monkey Island had a disk with 2 parts that you needed to set according to instructions to get the right answer.
- It was obviously much harder to distribute pirated copies then than it is now. The internet wasn't a thing so you were fairly limited in what you could acquire. Generally one of your friends had to actually buy the game. Sharing of games was fairly common, though.
New contributor
1
Monkey Island had "Dial A Pirate"!! I forgot all about that. 3.bp.blogspot.com/_FbFu1YBZ-Hw/TT-zIIDZAXI/AAAAAAAAAlk/…
– Jason Bray
2 days ago
Yep. was a great game all around.
– xyious
2 days ago
2
while true, this would be more appropriately made a comment than an answer since it's not really relevant to the question.
– peter ferrie
2 days ago
Funnily enough, many games had their copy protection removed when they were re-published on CD!
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
As to point 2, many bbs's back then were full of pirated games/apps (though the long distance charges could add up to the cost of the games). I haven't played games since then but I had assumed it was much harder to pirate now. Don't most of these games require an active connection to some game server, this "game as a service" model?
– Hasse1987
2 days ago
|
show 1 more comment
up vote
8
down vote
up vote
8
down vote
In addition to Stephen Kitt's answer:
- Copy protection existed long before CDs. Many games that were shipped on floppies had copy protection - sometimes a question in the beginning that asked you to look at the booklet it came with, Monkey Island had a disk with 2 parts that you needed to set according to instructions to get the right answer.
- It was obviously much harder to distribute pirated copies then than it is now. The internet wasn't a thing so you were fairly limited in what you could acquire. Generally one of your friends had to actually buy the game. Sharing of games was fairly common, though.
New contributor
In addition to Stephen Kitt's answer:
- Copy protection existed long before CDs. Many games that were shipped on floppies had copy protection - sometimes a question in the beginning that asked you to look at the booklet it came with, Monkey Island had a disk with 2 parts that you needed to set according to instructions to get the right answer.
- It was obviously much harder to distribute pirated copies then than it is now. The internet wasn't a thing so you were fairly limited in what you could acquire. Generally one of your friends had to actually buy the game. Sharing of games was fairly common, though.
New contributor
edited 2 days ago
manassehkatz
1,616216
1,616216
New contributor
answered 2 days ago
xyious
1812
1812
New contributor
New contributor
1
Monkey Island had "Dial A Pirate"!! I forgot all about that. 3.bp.blogspot.com/_FbFu1YBZ-Hw/TT-zIIDZAXI/AAAAAAAAAlk/…
– Jason Bray
2 days ago
Yep. was a great game all around.
– xyious
2 days ago
2
while true, this would be more appropriately made a comment than an answer since it's not really relevant to the question.
– peter ferrie
2 days ago
Funnily enough, many games had their copy protection removed when they were re-published on CD!
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
As to point 2, many bbs's back then were full of pirated games/apps (though the long distance charges could add up to the cost of the games). I haven't played games since then but I had assumed it was much harder to pirate now. Don't most of these games require an active connection to some game server, this "game as a service" model?
– Hasse1987
2 days ago
|
show 1 more comment
1
Monkey Island had "Dial A Pirate"!! I forgot all about that. 3.bp.blogspot.com/_FbFu1YBZ-Hw/TT-zIIDZAXI/AAAAAAAAAlk/…
– Jason Bray
2 days ago
Yep. was a great game all around.
– xyious
2 days ago
2
while true, this would be more appropriately made a comment than an answer since it's not really relevant to the question.
– peter ferrie
2 days ago
Funnily enough, many games had their copy protection removed when they were re-published on CD!
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
As to point 2, many bbs's back then were full of pirated games/apps (though the long distance charges could add up to the cost of the games). I haven't played games since then but I had assumed it was much harder to pirate now. Don't most of these games require an active connection to some game server, this "game as a service" model?
– Hasse1987
2 days ago
1
1
Monkey Island had "Dial A Pirate"!! I forgot all about that. 3.bp.blogspot.com/_FbFu1YBZ-Hw/TT-zIIDZAXI/AAAAAAAAAlk/…
– Jason Bray
2 days ago
Monkey Island had "Dial A Pirate"!! I forgot all about that. 3.bp.blogspot.com/_FbFu1YBZ-Hw/TT-zIIDZAXI/AAAAAAAAAlk/…
– Jason Bray
2 days ago
Yep. was a great game all around.
– xyious
2 days ago
Yep. was a great game all around.
– xyious
2 days ago
2
2
while true, this would be more appropriately made a comment than an answer since it's not really relevant to the question.
– peter ferrie
2 days ago
while true, this would be more appropriately made a comment than an answer since it's not really relevant to the question.
– peter ferrie
2 days ago
Funnily enough, many games had their copy protection removed when they were re-published on CD!
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
Funnily enough, many games had their copy protection removed when they were re-published on CD!
– Stephen Kitt
2 days ago
As to point 2, many bbs's back then were full of pirated games/apps (though the long distance charges could add up to the cost of the games). I haven't played games since then but I had assumed it was much harder to pirate now. Don't most of these games require an active connection to some game server, this "game as a service" model?
– Hasse1987
2 days ago
As to point 2, many bbs's back then were full of pirated games/apps (though the long distance charges could add up to the cost of the games). I haven't played games since then but I had assumed it was much harder to pirate now. Don't most of these games require an active connection to some game server, this "game as a service" model?
– Hasse1987
2 days ago
|
show 1 more comment
up vote
7
down vote
It's probably not exact but Sony back in the day had a really cool way of Protection against pirates:
Simply said they changed the CD itself... and made it "Wobble" in a certain way in the beginning so the reader knew it's an OEM Disk.
New contributor
make this a comment, but it's really cool idea.
– BasementJoe
2 days ago
2
@BasementJoe No, I think this is an answer to the question, and shouldn't be made a comment. It provides a way that CD-ROMs were protected against piracy. That's an answer!
– wizzwizz4♦
2 days ago
Sony got it from CD-R, a joint Philips and Sony spec, which uses this technique, called Absolute Time in Pregroove as a backwards compatible way of letting the drive know that a disc is writeable.
– user71659
2 days ago
FWIW, the disc doesn't physically wobble. For the ATIP, the spiral "groove" has a slight wobble that the read head can pick up. On a related note, some people asserted that the "black" plastic used on PlayStation games was part of the protection, but if you hold them up to the light you can see it's actually dark red, transparent to the IR laser. (cf. cdrfaq.org/faq03.html#S3-4, cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-24 )
– fadden
9 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
7
down vote
It's probably not exact but Sony back in the day had a really cool way of Protection against pirates:
Simply said they changed the CD itself... and made it "Wobble" in a certain way in the beginning so the reader knew it's an OEM Disk.
New contributor
make this a comment, but it's really cool idea.
– BasementJoe
2 days ago
2
@BasementJoe No, I think this is an answer to the question, and shouldn't be made a comment. It provides a way that CD-ROMs were protected against piracy. That's an answer!
– wizzwizz4♦
2 days ago
Sony got it from CD-R, a joint Philips and Sony spec, which uses this technique, called Absolute Time in Pregroove as a backwards compatible way of letting the drive know that a disc is writeable.
– user71659
2 days ago
FWIW, the disc doesn't physically wobble. For the ATIP, the spiral "groove" has a slight wobble that the read head can pick up. On a related note, some people asserted that the "black" plastic used on PlayStation games was part of the protection, but if you hold them up to the light you can see it's actually dark red, transparent to the IR laser. (cf. cdrfaq.org/faq03.html#S3-4, cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-24 )
– fadden
9 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
7
down vote
up vote
7
down vote
It's probably not exact but Sony back in the day had a really cool way of Protection against pirates:
Simply said they changed the CD itself... and made it "Wobble" in a certain way in the beginning so the reader knew it's an OEM Disk.
New contributor
It's probably not exact but Sony back in the day had a really cool way of Protection against pirates:
Simply said they changed the CD itself... and made it "Wobble" in a certain way in the beginning so the reader knew it's an OEM Disk.
New contributor
edited yesterday
muru
1054
1054
New contributor
answered 2 days ago
Michael Tsimmerman
711
711
New contributor
New contributor
make this a comment, but it's really cool idea.
– BasementJoe
2 days ago
2
@BasementJoe No, I think this is an answer to the question, and shouldn't be made a comment. It provides a way that CD-ROMs were protected against piracy. That's an answer!
– wizzwizz4♦
2 days ago
Sony got it from CD-R, a joint Philips and Sony spec, which uses this technique, called Absolute Time in Pregroove as a backwards compatible way of letting the drive know that a disc is writeable.
– user71659
2 days ago
FWIW, the disc doesn't physically wobble. For the ATIP, the spiral "groove" has a slight wobble that the read head can pick up. On a related note, some people asserted that the "black" plastic used on PlayStation games was part of the protection, but if you hold them up to the light you can see it's actually dark red, transparent to the IR laser. (cf. cdrfaq.org/faq03.html#S3-4, cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-24 )
– fadden
9 hours ago
add a comment |
make this a comment, but it's really cool idea.
– BasementJoe
2 days ago
2
@BasementJoe No, I think this is an answer to the question, and shouldn't be made a comment. It provides a way that CD-ROMs were protected against piracy. That's an answer!
– wizzwizz4♦
2 days ago
Sony got it from CD-R, a joint Philips and Sony spec, which uses this technique, called Absolute Time in Pregroove as a backwards compatible way of letting the drive know that a disc is writeable.
– user71659
2 days ago
FWIW, the disc doesn't physically wobble. For the ATIP, the spiral "groove" has a slight wobble that the read head can pick up. On a related note, some people asserted that the "black" plastic used on PlayStation games was part of the protection, but if you hold them up to the light you can see it's actually dark red, transparent to the IR laser. (cf. cdrfaq.org/faq03.html#S3-4, cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-24 )
– fadden
9 hours ago
make this a comment, but it's really cool idea.
– BasementJoe
2 days ago
make this a comment, but it's really cool idea.
– BasementJoe
2 days ago
2
2
@BasementJoe No, I think this is an answer to the question, and shouldn't be made a comment. It provides a way that CD-ROMs were protected against piracy. That's an answer!
– wizzwizz4♦
2 days ago
@BasementJoe No, I think this is an answer to the question, and shouldn't be made a comment. It provides a way that CD-ROMs were protected against piracy. That's an answer!
– wizzwizz4♦
2 days ago
Sony got it from CD-R, a joint Philips and Sony spec, which uses this technique, called Absolute Time in Pregroove as a backwards compatible way of letting the drive know that a disc is writeable.
– user71659
2 days ago
Sony got it from CD-R, a joint Philips and Sony spec, which uses this technique, called Absolute Time in Pregroove as a backwards compatible way of letting the drive know that a disc is writeable.
– user71659
2 days ago
FWIW, the disc doesn't physically wobble. For the ATIP, the spiral "groove" has a slight wobble that the read head can pick up. On a related note, some people asserted that the "black" plastic used on PlayStation games was part of the protection, but if you hold them up to the light you can see it's actually dark red, transparent to the IR laser. (cf. cdrfaq.org/faq03.html#S3-4, cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-24 )
– fadden
9 hours ago
FWIW, the disc doesn't physically wobble. For the ATIP, the spiral "groove" has a slight wobble that the read head can pick up. On a related note, some people asserted that the "black" plastic used on PlayStation games was part of the protection, but if you hold them up to the light you can see it's actually dark red, transparent to the IR laser. (cf. cdrfaq.org/faq03.html#S3-4, cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-24 )
– fadden
9 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
5
down vote
Besides the measures against copying the CD-ROM there were other things.
Pretty popular were dongles: specific hardware devices put one the parallel port. The game (or other software) did not run without those dongles. The dongles could not be copied easily.
New contributor
Well... You say that, but some of them were just dumb "wire this pin to that pin" that could be replicated with a filed paperclip.
– wizzwizz4♦
yesterday
How many games had dongles? I never came across one...
– Stephen Kitt
yesterday
2
@StephenKitt Dongles were more the purview of professional specialist software. Some still use dongles to this day!
– 520
17 hours ago
1
@520 I know what dongles are and where they are typically used ;-). I’m curious about specific mention of games in this answer.
– Stephen Kitt
17 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
5
down vote
Besides the measures against copying the CD-ROM there were other things.
Pretty popular were dongles: specific hardware devices put one the parallel port. The game (or other software) did not run without those dongles. The dongles could not be copied easily.
New contributor
Well... You say that, but some of them were just dumb "wire this pin to that pin" that could be replicated with a filed paperclip.
– wizzwizz4♦
yesterday
How many games had dongles? I never came across one...
– Stephen Kitt
yesterday
2
@StephenKitt Dongles were more the purview of professional specialist software. Some still use dongles to this day!
– 520
17 hours ago
1
@520 I know what dongles are and where they are typically used ;-). I’m curious about specific mention of games in this answer.
– Stephen Kitt
17 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
5
down vote
up vote
5
down vote
Besides the measures against copying the CD-ROM there were other things.
Pretty popular were dongles: specific hardware devices put one the parallel port. The game (or other software) did not run without those dongles. The dongles could not be copied easily.
New contributor
Besides the measures against copying the CD-ROM there were other things.
Pretty popular were dongles: specific hardware devices put one the parallel port. The game (or other software) did not run without those dongles. The dongles could not be copied easily.
New contributor
New contributor
answered 2 days ago
jknappen
1514
1514
New contributor
New contributor
Well... You say that, but some of them were just dumb "wire this pin to that pin" that could be replicated with a filed paperclip.
– wizzwizz4♦
yesterday
How many games had dongles? I never came across one...
– Stephen Kitt
yesterday
2
@StephenKitt Dongles were more the purview of professional specialist software. Some still use dongles to this day!
– 520
17 hours ago
1
@520 I know what dongles are and where they are typically used ;-). I’m curious about specific mention of games in this answer.
– Stephen Kitt
17 hours ago
add a comment |
Well... You say that, but some of them were just dumb "wire this pin to that pin" that could be replicated with a filed paperclip.
– wizzwizz4♦
yesterday
How many games had dongles? I never came across one...
– Stephen Kitt
yesterday
2
@StephenKitt Dongles were more the purview of professional specialist software. Some still use dongles to this day!
– 520
17 hours ago
1
@520 I know what dongles are and where they are typically used ;-). I’m curious about specific mention of games in this answer.
– Stephen Kitt
17 hours ago
Well... You say that, but some of them were just dumb "wire this pin to that pin" that could be replicated with a filed paperclip.
– wizzwizz4♦
yesterday
Well... You say that, but some of them were just dumb "wire this pin to that pin" that could be replicated with a filed paperclip.
– wizzwizz4♦
yesterday
How many games had dongles? I never came across one...
– Stephen Kitt
yesterday
How many games had dongles? I never came across one...
– Stephen Kitt
yesterday
2
2
@StephenKitt Dongles were more the purview of professional specialist software. Some still use dongles to this day!
– 520
17 hours ago
@StephenKitt Dongles were more the purview of professional specialist software. Some still use dongles to this day!
– 520
17 hours ago
1
1
@520 I know what dongles are and where they are typically used ;-). I’m curious about specific mention of games in this answer.
– Stephen Kitt
17 hours ago
@520 I know what dongles are and where they are typically used ;-). I’m curious about specific mention of games in this answer.
– Stephen Kitt
17 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
From what I remember - most successful was the Serial Number approach when every CD copy had a unique hash to verify the unit copy. Verification process would request a hash to validate the copy and flag it useable. Serial number was included as a sticker inside the CD package.
New contributor
How would that work? CDs (as opposed to recordable CDs) are mastered, so each copy is identical, to within manufacturing defect limits, and there is no real opportunity to introduce uniqueness to the process. Reading a whole CD on a contemporary system would take on the order of half an hour; nobody (to within experimental error) would buy a game that takes half an hour, or even 15 minutes (assuming you had one of those fancy quad-speed drives) to start.
– a CVn
13 hours ago
Pressed CDs can't be serialized. In theory you can add a barcode in the disc hub, but most drives can't read it. You need to find a way to differentiate a pressed CD from a CD-R, which is possible, but doesn't involve a serial number.
– fadden
9 hours ago
The key for the software was included in the CD packaging as a sticker or printed on the paper. Verification was included in the software setup package, later online activation became more common.
– charlie137
8 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
From what I remember - most successful was the Serial Number approach when every CD copy had a unique hash to verify the unit copy. Verification process would request a hash to validate the copy and flag it useable. Serial number was included as a sticker inside the CD package.
New contributor
How would that work? CDs (as opposed to recordable CDs) are mastered, so each copy is identical, to within manufacturing defect limits, and there is no real opportunity to introduce uniqueness to the process. Reading a whole CD on a contemporary system would take on the order of half an hour; nobody (to within experimental error) would buy a game that takes half an hour, or even 15 minutes (assuming you had one of those fancy quad-speed drives) to start.
– a CVn
13 hours ago
Pressed CDs can't be serialized. In theory you can add a barcode in the disc hub, but most drives can't read it. You need to find a way to differentiate a pressed CD from a CD-R, which is possible, but doesn't involve a serial number.
– fadden
9 hours ago
The key for the software was included in the CD packaging as a sticker or printed on the paper. Verification was included in the software setup package, later online activation became more common.
– charlie137
8 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
up vote
1
down vote
From what I remember - most successful was the Serial Number approach when every CD copy had a unique hash to verify the unit copy. Verification process would request a hash to validate the copy and flag it useable. Serial number was included as a sticker inside the CD package.
New contributor
From what I remember - most successful was the Serial Number approach when every CD copy had a unique hash to verify the unit copy. Verification process would request a hash to validate the copy and flag it useable. Serial number was included as a sticker inside the CD package.
New contributor
edited 8 hours ago
New contributor
answered yesterday
charlie137
113
113
New contributor
New contributor
How would that work? CDs (as opposed to recordable CDs) are mastered, so each copy is identical, to within manufacturing defect limits, and there is no real opportunity to introduce uniqueness to the process. Reading a whole CD on a contemporary system would take on the order of half an hour; nobody (to within experimental error) would buy a game that takes half an hour, or even 15 minutes (assuming you had one of those fancy quad-speed drives) to start.
– a CVn
13 hours ago
Pressed CDs can't be serialized. In theory you can add a barcode in the disc hub, but most drives can't read it. You need to find a way to differentiate a pressed CD from a CD-R, which is possible, but doesn't involve a serial number.
– fadden
9 hours ago
The key for the software was included in the CD packaging as a sticker or printed on the paper. Verification was included in the software setup package, later online activation became more common.
– charlie137
8 hours ago
add a comment |
How would that work? CDs (as opposed to recordable CDs) are mastered, so each copy is identical, to within manufacturing defect limits, and there is no real opportunity to introduce uniqueness to the process. Reading a whole CD on a contemporary system would take on the order of half an hour; nobody (to within experimental error) would buy a game that takes half an hour, or even 15 minutes (assuming you had one of those fancy quad-speed drives) to start.
– a CVn
13 hours ago
Pressed CDs can't be serialized. In theory you can add a barcode in the disc hub, but most drives can't read it. You need to find a way to differentiate a pressed CD from a CD-R, which is possible, but doesn't involve a serial number.
– fadden
9 hours ago
The key for the software was included in the CD packaging as a sticker or printed on the paper. Verification was included in the software setup package, later online activation became more common.
– charlie137
8 hours ago
How would that work? CDs (as opposed to recordable CDs) are mastered, so each copy is identical, to within manufacturing defect limits, and there is no real opportunity to introduce uniqueness to the process. Reading a whole CD on a contemporary system would take on the order of half an hour; nobody (to within experimental error) would buy a game that takes half an hour, or even 15 minutes (assuming you had one of those fancy quad-speed drives) to start.
– a CVn
13 hours ago
How would that work? CDs (as opposed to recordable CDs) are mastered, so each copy is identical, to within manufacturing defect limits, and there is no real opportunity to introduce uniqueness to the process. Reading a whole CD on a contemporary system would take on the order of half an hour; nobody (to within experimental error) would buy a game that takes half an hour, or even 15 minutes (assuming you had one of those fancy quad-speed drives) to start.
– a CVn
13 hours ago
Pressed CDs can't be serialized. In theory you can add a barcode in the disc hub, but most drives can't read it. You need to find a way to differentiate a pressed CD from a CD-R, which is possible, but doesn't involve a serial number.
– fadden
9 hours ago
Pressed CDs can't be serialized. In theory you can add a barcode in the disc hub, but most drives can't read it. You need to find a way to differentiate a pressed CD from a CD-R, which is possible, but doesn't involve a serial number.
– fadden
9 hours ago
The key for the software was included in the CD packaging as a sticker or printed on the paper. Verification was included in the software setup package, later online activation became more common.
– charlie137
8 hours ago
The key for the software was included in the CD packaging as a sticker or printed on the paper. Verification was included in the software setup package, later online activation became more common.
– charlie137
8 hours ago
add a comment |
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4
Not only was there little/no protections, the original Diablo game came with a second CD which you could use to install the game (multi-player only) on friends' machines.
– David Rice
2 days ago
1
@DavidRice Except Diablo expects the CD to be in the drive at all times, so I guess they were effectively giving you 2 licenses. Happens I'm playing it right now...
– Harper
2 days ago
10
Size. It required 500 floppies to make a copy of a full cd, so the media itself was the copy protection. Later all kinds of cd-copying protections were added.
– Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen
yesterday
@ThorbjørnRavnAndersen - HA! I remember attempting to copy a game I had to a floppy disk once, and it was just an endless cycle of places new disks in the drive as each would fill up. I didn't know much about computers at the time, but I guess you're right.
– BasementJoe
yesterday
3
Took a long time until CD-R devices become affordable enough to buy by most people.
– mathreadler
yesterday