Showing that there is a surjective map from $Bbb Z ast Bbb Z$ to $C_2 ast C_3$ just using universal property...
I am solving Allufi chapter $0$ exercise $3.7$. There is a easy way to solve this if we know how the coproduct of $Bbb Z ast Bbb Z$ and $C_2 ast C_3$. I was wondering if there is an abstract approach to solving this without knowing information about the groups.
abstract-algebra group-theory category-theory group-homomorphism free-product
add a comment |
I am solving Allufi chapter $0$ exercise $3.7$. There is a easy way to solve this if we know how the coproduct of $Bbb Z ast Bbb Z$ and $C_2 ast C_3$. I was wondering if there is an abstract approach to solving this without knowing information about the groups.
abstract-algebra group-theory category-theory group-homomorphism free-product
Well morally you should know some information about the groups. Otherwise this would work for any such collection of groups. That would imply some rather bogus results.
– Antonios-Alexandros Robotis
Dec 8 at 21:44
I think I figured it out. I will post answer as soon as I finalize the solution. It is pretty neat.
– Newbie
Dec 8 at 21:54
add a comment |
I am solving Allufi chapter $0$ exercise $3.7$. There is a easy way to solve this if we know how the coproduct of $Bbb Z ast Bbb Z$ and $C_2 ast C_3$. I was wondering if there is an abstract approach to solving this without knowing information about the groups.
abstract-algebra group-theory category-theory group-homomorphism free-product
I am solving Allufi chapter $0$ exercise $3.7$. There is a easy way to solve this if we know how the coproduct of $Bbb Z ast Bbb Z$ and $C_2 ast C_3$. I was wondering if there is an abstract approach to solving this without knowing information about the groups.
abstract-algebra group-theory category-theory group-homomorphism free-product
abstract-algebra group-theory category-theory group-homomorphism free-product
edited Dec 8 at 22:38
Batominovski
33.7k33292
33.7k33292
asked Dec 8 at 21:40
Newbie
426211
426211
Well morally you should know some information about the groups. Otherwise this would work for any such collection of groups. That would imply some rather bogus results.
– Antonios-Alexandros Robotis
Dec 8 at 21:44
I think I figured it out. I will post answer as soon as I finalize the solution. It is pretty neat.
– Newbie
Dec 8 at 21:54
add a comment |
Well morally you should know some information about the groups. Otherwise this would work for any such collection of groups. That would imply some rather bogus results.
– Antonios-Alexandros Robotis
Dec 8 at 21:44
I think I figured it out. I will post answer as soon as I finalize the solution. It is pretty neat.
– Newbie
Dec 8 at 21:54
Well morally you should know some information about the groups. Otherwise this would work for any such collection of groups. That would imply some rather bogus results.
– Antonios-Alexandros Robotis
Dec 8 at 21:44
Well morally you should know some information about the groups. Otherwise this would work for any such collection of groups. That would imply some rather bogus results.
– Antonios-Alexandros Robotis
Dec 8 at 21:44
I think I figured it out. I will post answer as soon as I finalize the solution. It is pretty neat.
– Newbie
Dec 8 at 21:54
I think I figured it out. I will post answer as soon as I finalize the solution. It is pretty neat.
– Newbie
Dec 8 at 21:54
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
First, let $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ be a left-adjoint covariant functor from a category $mathbf{C}$ to a category $mathbf{D}$, that is, there exists a covariant functor $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ such that $$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)congtext{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x,S(y)big)text{ for all }xinmathbf{C}text{ and }yinmathbf{D},.$$
We claim that $T$ preserves epimorphisms. Suppose that $f:xto x'$ is an epimorphism of objects $x,x'inmathbf{C}$. Then, $T(f):T(x)to T(x')$ is an epimorphism if and only if
$$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)overset{F}{longrightarrow }text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)$$
is an injective function, where $F(phi):=phicirc T(f)$ for all $phiin text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)$. By left-adjointness of $T$, $F$ induces a map
$$text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)overset{F'}{longrightarrow}text{hom}_mathbf{C}(x,S(y)big),,$$
where $F'=psicirc f$ for all $psiin text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)$. As $f$ is an epimorphism, $F'$ is an injective function, and so is $F$. Therefore, $T(f)$ is also an epimorphism.
Fix an index set $I$. Let $mathbf{D}$ be the category of groups (or any category that admits coproducts on the index set $I$), and $mathbf{C}$ the product category $prodlimits_{iin I},mathbf{D}$. That is, the objects of $mathbf{C}$ are families $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of objects in $mathbf{D}$ and morphisms from an object $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ to an object $(H_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ are the families $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ of morphisms $phi_i:G_ito H_i$ in $mathbf{D}$. Note that $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ is an epimorphism in $mathbf{C}$ if and only if each $phi_i$ is an epimorphism.
Take $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ to be the $I$-coproduct functor:
$$TBig(left(G_iright)_{iin I}Big):=coprod_{iin I},G_itext{ for all }G_iin mathbf{D}text{ where }iin I,.$$
Then, $T$ is a left-adjoint covariant functor, with the right adjoint being $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ defined by
$$S(G):=(G)_{iin I}text{ for each }Gin textbf{D},.$$
Thus, $T$ preserves epimorphisms.
On the other hand, it is an unrelated happy coincidence that $T$ also preserves monomorphisms in the case $mathbf{D}$ is the category of groups. This is not true in the general setting. For reference, see here.
Outstanding pretty neat thank you.
– Newbie
Dec 10 at 14:26
add a comment |
Do you mean something like this? Let $phi_1:G_1to H_1$ and $phi_2:G_2to H_2$ be homomorphisms of groups $G_1$, $G_2$, $H_1$, and $H_2$. Then, $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ induces a group homomorphism
$$phi:=phi_1*phi_2:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$$
defined by
$$phi(g_1^1g_2^1g_1^2g_2^2cdots g_1^kg_2^k):=phi_1(g_1^1),phi_2(g_2^1),phi_1(g_1^2),phi_2(g_2^2),cdots ,phi_1(g_1^k),phi_2(g_2^k)$$
for all $g_1^1,g_1^2,ldots,g_1^kin G_1$ and $g_2^1,g_2^2,ldots,g_2^kin G_2$. The map $phi$ is injective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are injective. The map $phi$ is surjective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are surjective.
Proof. Let $iota_1$ and $iota_2$ denote the canonical injections $G_1to (G_1*G_2)$ and $G_2to (G_1*G_2)$, respectively. Similarly, $i_1:H_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $i_2:H_2to(H_1*H_2)$ are the canonical injections. We note that there exist maps $psi_1:=i_1circ phi_1:G_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $psi_2:=i_2circphi_2:G_2to (H_1*H_2)$. By universality of coproducts, there exists a unique map $phi:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$ such that $phicirciota_1=psi_1$ and $phicirciota_2=psi_2$. Check that $phi$ is the map given above. The rest (regarding injectivity or surjectivity of $phi$) is trivial.
I was wondering can we get surjectivity for free? What if we don't know how the free product looks like ?
– Newbie
Dec 9 at 16:38
@Newbie Yes, see my additional answer.
– Batominovski
Dec 10 at 1:45
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["$", "$"], ["\\(","\\)"]]);
});
});
}, "mathjax-editing");
StackExchange.ready(function() {
var channelOptions = {
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "69"
};
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
createEditor();
});
}
else {
createEditor();
}
});
function createEditor() {
StackExchange.prepareEditor({
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: true,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: 10,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader: {
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
},
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
});
}
});
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f3031667%2fshowing-that-there-is-a-surjective-map-from-bbb-z-ast-bbb-z-to-c-2-ast-c%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
First, let $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ be a left-adjoint covariant functor from a category $mathbf{C}$ to a category $mathbf{D}$, that is, there exists a covariant functor $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ such that $$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)congtext{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x,S(y)big)text{ for all }xinmathbf{C}text{ and }yinmathbf{D},.$$
We claim that $T$ preserves epimorphisms. Suppose that $f:xto x'$ is an epimorphism of objects $x,x'inmathbf{C}$. Then, $T(f):T(x)to T(x')$ is an epimorphism if and only if
$$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)overset{F}{longrightarrow }text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)$$
is an injective function, where $F(phi):=phicirc T(f)$ for all $phiin text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)$. By left-adjointness of $T$, $F$ induces a map
$$text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)overset{F'}{longrightarrow}text{hom}_mathbf{C}(x,S(y)big),,$$
where $F'=psicirc f$ for all $psiin text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)$. As $f$ is an epimorphism, $F'$ is an injective function, and so is $F$. Therefore, $T(f)$ is also an epimorphism.
Fix an index set $I$. Let $mathbf{D}$ be the category of groups (or any category that admits coproducts on the index set $I$), and $mathbf{C}$ the product category $prodlimits_{iin I},mathbf{D}$. That is, the objects of $mathbf{C}$ are families $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of objects in $mathbf{D}$ and morphisms from an object $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ to an object $(H_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ are the families $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ of morphisms $phi_i:G_ito H_i$ in $mathbf{D}$. Note that $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ is an epimorphism in $mathbf{C}$ if and only if each $phi_i$ is an epimorphism.
Take $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ to be the $I$-coproduct functor:
$$TBig(left(G_iright)_{iin I}Big):=coprod_{iin I},G_itext{ for all }G_iin mathbf{D}text{ where }iin I,.$$
Then, $T$ is a left-adjoint covariant functor, with the right adjoint being $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ defined by
$$S(G):=(G)_{iin I}text{ for each }Gin textbf{D},.$$
Thus, $T$ preserves epimorphisms.
On the other hand, it is an unrelated happy coincidence that $T$ also preserves monomorphisms in the case $mathbf{D}$ is the category of groups. This is not true in the general setting. For reference, see here.
Outstanding pretty neat thank you.
– Newbie
Dec 10 at 14:26
add a comment |
First, let $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ be a left-adjoint covariant functor from a category $mathbf{C}$ to a category $mathbf{D}$, that is, there exists a covariant functor $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ such that $$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)congtext{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x,S(y)big)text{ for all }xinmathbf{C}text{ and }yinmathbf{D},.$$
We claim that $T$ preserves epimorphisms. Suppose that $f:xto x'$ is an epimorphism of objects $x,x'inmathbf{C}$. Then, $T(f):T(x)to T(x')$ is an epimorphism if and only if
$$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)overset{F}{longrightarrow }text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)$$
is an injective function, where $F(phi):=phicirc T(f)$ for all $phiin text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)$. By left-adjointness of $T$, $F$ induces a map
$$text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)overset{F'}{longrightarrow}text{hom}_mathbf{C}(x,S(y)big),,$$
where $F'=psicirc f$ for all $psiin text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)$. As $f$ is an epimorphism, $F'$ is an injective function, and so is $F$. Therefore, $T(f)$ is also an epimorphism.
Fix an index set $I$. Let $mathbf{D}$ be the category of groups (or any category that admits coproducts on the index set $I$), and $mathbf{C}$ the product category $prodlimits_{iin I},mathbf{D}$. That is, the objects of $mathbf{C}$ are families $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of objects in $mathbf{D}$ and morphisms from an object $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ to an object $(H_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ are the families $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ of morphisms $phi_i:G_ito H_i$ in $mathbf{D}$. Note that $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ is an epimorphism in $mathbf{C}$ if and only if each $phi_i$ is an epimorphism.
Take $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ to be the $I$-coproduct functor:
$$TBig(left(G_iright)_{iin I}Big):=coprod_{iin I},G_itext{ for all }G_iin mathbf{D}text{ where }iin I,.$$
Then, $T$ is a left-adjoint covariant functor, with the right adjoint being $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ defined by
$$S(G):=(G)_{iin I}text{ for each }Gin textbf{D},.$$
Thus, $T$ preserves epimorphisms.
On the other hand, it is an unrelated happy coincidence that $T$ also preserves monomorphisms in the case $mathbf{D}$ is the category of groups. This is not true in the general setting. For reference, see here.
Outstanding pretty neat thank you.
– Newbie
Dec 10 at 14:26
add a comment |
First, let $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ be a left-adjoint covariant functor from a category $mathbf{C}$ to a category $mathbf{D}$, that is, there exists a covariant functor $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ such that $$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)congtext{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x,S(y)big)text{ for all }xinmathbf{C}text{ and }yinmathbf{D},.$$
We claim that $T$ preserves epimorphisms. Suppose that $f:xto x'$ is an epimorphism of objects $x,x'inmathbf{C}$. Then, $T(f):T(x)to T(x')$ is an epimorphism if and only if
$$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)overset{F}{longrightarrow }text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)$$
is an injective function, where $F(phi):=phicirc T(f)$ for all $phiin text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)$. By left-adjointness of $T$, $F$ induces a map
$$text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)overset{F'}{longrightarrow}text{hom}_mathbf{C}(x,S(y)big),,$$
where $F'=psicirc f$ for all $psiin text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)$. As $f$ is an epimorphism, $F'$ is an injective function, and so is $F$. Therefore, $T(f)$ is also an epimorphism.
Fix an index set $I$. Let $mathbf{D}$ be the category of groups (or any category that admits coproducts on the index set $I$), and $mathbf{C}$ the product category $prodlimits_{iin I},mathbf{D}$. That is, the objects of $mathbf{C}$ are families $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of objects in $mathbf{D}$ and morphisms from an object $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ to an object $(H_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ are the families $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ of morphisms $phi_i:G_ito H_i$ in $mathbf{D}$. Note that $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ is an epimorphism in $mathbf{C}$ if and only if each $phi_i$ is an epimorphism.
Take $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ to be the $I$-coproduct functor:
$$TBig(left(G_iright)_{iin I}Big):=coprod_{iin I},G_itext{ for all }G_iin mathbf{D}text{ where }iin I,.$$
Then, $T$ is a left-adjoint covariant functor, with the right adjoint being $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ defined by
$$S(G):=(G)_{iin I}text{ for each }Gin textbf{D},.$$
Thus, $T$ preserves epimorphisms.
On the other hand, it is an unrelated happy coincidence that $T$ also preserves monomorphisms in the case $mathbf{D}$ is the category of groups. This is not true in the general setting. For reference, see here.
First, let $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ be a left-adjoint covariant functor from a category $mathbf{C}$ to a category $mathbf{D}$, that is, there exists a covariant functor $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ such that $$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)congtext{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x,S(y)big)text{ for all }xinmathbf{C}text{ and }yinmathbf{D},.$$
We claim that $T$ preserves epimorphisms. Suppose that $f:xto x'$ is an epimorphism of objects $x,x'inmathbf{C}$. Then, $T(f):T(x)to T(x')$ is an epimorphism if and only if
$$text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)overset{F}{longrightarrow }text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x),ybig)$$
is an injective function, where $F(phi):=phicirc T(f)$ for all $phiin text{hom}_mathbf{D}big(T(x'),ybig)$. By left-adjointness of $T$, $F$ induces a map
$$text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)overset{F'}{longrightarrow}text{hom}_mathbf{C}(x,S(y)big),,$$
where $F'=psicirc f$ for all $psiin text{hom}_mathbf{C}big(x',S(y)big)$. As $f$ is an epimorphism, $F'$ is an injective function, and so is $F$. Therefore, $T(f)$ is also an epimorphism.
Fix an index set $I$. Let $mathbf{D}$ be the category of groups (or any category that admits coproducts on the index set $I$), and $mathbf{C}$ the product category $prodlimits_{iin I},mathbf{D}$. That is, the objects of $mathbf{C}$ are families $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of objects in $mathbf{D}$ and morphisms from an object $(G_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ to an object $(H_i)_{iin I}$ of $mathbf{C}$ are the families $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ of morphisms $phi_i:G_ito H_i$ in $mathbf{D}$. Note that $(phi_i)_{iin I}$ is an epimorphism in $mathbf{C}$ if and only if each $phi_i$ is an epimorphism.
Take $T:mathbf{C}tomathbf{D}$ to be the $I$-coproduct functor:
$$TBig(left(G_iright)_{iin I}Big):=coprod_{iin I},G_itext{ for all }G_iin mathbf{D}text{ where }iin I,.$$
Then, $T$ is a left-adjoint covariant functor, with the right adjoint being $S:mathbf{D}tomathbf{C}$ defined by
$$S(G):=(G)_{iin I}text{ for each }Gin textbf{D},.$$
Thus, $T$ preserves epimorphisms.
On the other hand, it is an unrelated happy coincidence that $T$ also preserves monomorphisms in the case $mathbf{D}$ is the category of groups. This is not true in the general setting. For reference, see here.
edited Dec 10 at 21:12
answered Dec 10 at 1:45
Batominovski
33.7k33292
33.7k33292
Outstanding pretty neat thank you.
– Newbie
Dec 10 at 14:26
add a comment |
Outstanding pretty neat thank you.
– Newbie
Dec 10 at 14:26
Outstanding pretty neat thank you.
– Newbie
Dec 10 at 14:26
Outstanding pretty neat thank you.
– Newbie
Dec 10 at 14:26
add a comment |
Do you mean something like this? Let $phi_1:G_1to H_1$ and $phi_2:G_2to H_2$ be homomorphisms of groups $G_1$, $G_2$, $H_1$, and $H_2$. Then, $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ induces a group homomorphism
$$phi:=phi_1*phi_2:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$$
defined by
$$phi(g_1^1g_2^1g_1^2g_2^2cdots g_1^kg_2^k):=phi_1(g_1^1),phi_2(g_2^1),phi_1(g_1^2),phi_2(g_2^2),cdots ,phi_1(g_1^k),phi_2(g_2^k)$$
for all $g_1^1,g_1^2,ldots,g_1^kin G_1$ and $g_2^1,g_2^2,ldots,g_2^kin G_2$. The map $phi$ is injective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are injective. The map $phi$ is surjective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are surjective.
Proof. Let $iota_1$ and $iota_2$ denote the canonical injections $G_1to (G_1*G_2)$ and $G_2to (G_1*G_2)$, respectively. Similarly, $i_1:H_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $i_2:H_2to(H_1*H_2)$ are the canonical injections. We note that there exist maps $psi_1:=i_1circ phi_1:G_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $psi_2:=i_2circphi_2:G_2to (H_1*H_2)$. By universality of coproducts, there exists a unique map $phi:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$ such that $phicirciota_1=psi_1$ and $phicirciota_2=psi_2$. Check that $phi$ is the map given above. The rest (regarding injectivity or surjectivity of $phi$) is trivial.
I was wondering can we get surjectivity for free? What if we don't know how the free product looks like ?
– Newbie
Dec 9 at 16:38
@Newbie Yes, see my additional answer.
– Batominovski
Dec 10 at 1:45
add a comment |
Do you mean something like this? Let $phi_1:G_1to H_1$ and $phi_2:G_2to H_2$ be homomorphisms of groups $G_1$, $G_2$, $H_1$, and $H_2$. Then, $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ induces a group homomorphism
$$phi:=phi_1*phi_2:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$$
defined by
$$phi(g_1^1g_2^1g_1^2g_2^2cdots g_1^kg_2^k):=phi_1(g_1^1),phi_2(g_2^1),phi_1(g_1^2),phi_2(g_2^2),cdots ,phi_1(g_1^k),phi_2(g_2^k)$$
for all $g_1^1,g_1^2,ldots,g_1^kin G_1$ and $g_2^1,g_2^2,ldots,g_2^kin G_2$. The map $phi$ is injective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are injective. The map $phi$ is surjective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are surjective.
Proof. Let $iota_1$ and $iota_2$ denote the canonical injections $G_1to (G_1*G_2)$ and $G_2to (G_1*G_2)$, respectively. Similarly, $i_1:H_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $i_2:H_2to(H_1*H_2)$ are the canonical injections. We note that there exist maps $psi_1:=i_1circ phi_1:G_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $psi_2:=i_2circphi_2:G_2to (H_1*H_2)$. By universality of coproducts, there exists a unique map $phi:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$ such that $phicirciota_1=psi_1$ and $phicirciota_2=psi_2$. Check that $phi$ is the map given above. The rest (regarding injectivity or surjectivity of $phi$) is trivial.
I was wondering can we get surjectivity for free? What if we don't know how the free product looks like ?
– Newbie
Dec 9 at 16:38
@Newbie Yes, see my additional answer.
– Batominovski
Dec 10 at 1:45
add a comment |
Do you mean something like this? Let $phi_1:G_1to H_1$ and $phi_2:G_2to H_2$ be homomorphisms of groups $G_1$, $G_2$, $H_1$, and $H_2$. Then, $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ induces a group homomorphism
$$phi:=phi_1*phi_2:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$$
defined by
$$phi(g_1^1g_2^1g_1^2g_2^2cdots g_1^kg_2^k):=phi_1(g_1^1),phi_2(g_2^1),phi_1(g_1^2),phi_2(g_2^2),cdots ,phi_1(g_1^k),phi_2(g_2^k)$$
for all $g_1^1,g_1^2,ldots,g_1^kin G_1$ and $g_2^1,g_2^2,ldots,g_2^kin G_2$. The map $phi$ is injective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are injective. The map $phi$ is surjective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are surjective.
Proof. Let $iota_1$ and $iota_2$ denote the canonical injections $G_1to (G_1*G_2)$ and $G_2to (G_1*G_2)$, respectively. Similarly, $i_1:H_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $i_2:H_2to(H_1*H_2)$ are the canonical injections. We note that there exist maps $psi_1:=i_1circ phi_1:G_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $psi_2:=i_2circphi_2:G_2to (H_1*H_2)$. By universality of coproducts, there exists a unique map $phi:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$ such that $phicirciota_1=psi_1$ and $phicirciota_2=psi_2$. Check that $phi$ is the map given above. The rest (regarding injectivity or surjectivity of $phi$) is trivial.
Do you mean something like this? Let $phi_1:G_1to H_1$ and $phi_2:G_2to H_2$ be homomorphisms of groups $G_1$, $G_2$, $H_1$, and $H_2$. Then, $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ induces a group homomorphism
$$phi:=phi_1*phi_2:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$$
defined by
$$phi(g_1^1g_2^1g_1^2g_2^2cdots g_1^kg_2^k):=phi_1(g_1^1),phi_2(g_2^1),phi_1(g_1^2),phi_2(g_2^2),cdots ,phi_1(g_1^k),phi_2(g_2^k)$$
for all $g_1^1,g_1^2,ldots,g_1^kin G_1$ and $g_2^1,g_2^2,ldots,g_2^kin G_2$. The map $phi$ is injective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are injective. The map $phi$ is surjective if and only if both $phi_1$ and $phi_2$ are surjective.
Proof. Let $iota_1$ and $iota_2$ denote the canonical injections $G_1to (G_1*G_2)$ and $G_2to (G_1*G_2)$, respectively. Similarly, $i_1:H_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $i_2:H_2to(H_1*H_2)$ are the canonical injections. We note that there exist maps $psi_1:=i_1circ phi_1:G_1to (H_1*H_2)$ and $psi_2:=i_2circphi_2:G_2to (H_1*H_2)$. By universality of coproducts, there exists a unique map $phi:(G_1*G_2)to (H_1*H_2)$ such that $phicirciota_1=psi_1$ and $phicirciota_2=psi_2$. Check that $phi$ is the map given above. The rest (regarding injectivity or surjectivity of $phi$) is trivial.
edited Dec 8 at 22:41
answered Dec 8 at 22:36
Batominovski
33.7k33292
33.7k33292
I was wondering can we get surjectivity for free? What if we don't know how the free product looks like ?
– Newbie
Dec 9 at 16:38
@Newbie Yes, see my additional answer.
– Batominovski
Dec 10 at 1:45
add a comment |
I was wondering can we get surjectivity for free? What if we don't know how the free product looks like ?
– Newbie
Dec 9 at 16:38
@Newbie Yes, see my additional answer.
– Batominovski
Dec 10 at 1:45
I was wondering can we get surjectivity for free? What if we don't know how the free product looks like ?
– Newbie
Dec 9 at 16:38
I was wondering can we get surjectivity for free? What if we don't know how the free product looks like ?
– Newbie
Dec 9 at 16:38
@Newbie Yes, see my additional answer.
– Batominovski
Dec 10 at 1:45
@Newbie Yes, see my additional answer.
– Batominovski
Dec 10 at 1:45
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Mathematics Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Some of your past answers have not been well-received, and you're in danger of being blocked from answering.
Please pay close attention to the following guidance:
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f3031667%2fshowing-that-there-is-a-surjective-map-from-bbb-z-ast-bbb-z-to-c-2-ast-c%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Well morally you should know some information about the groups. Otherwise this would work for any such collection of groups. That would imply some rather bogus results.
– Antonios-Alexandros Robotis
Dec 8 at 21:44
I think I figured it out. I will post answer as soon as I finalize the solution. It is pretty neat.
– Newbie
Dec 8 at 21:54