Intuitive explanation why integral sin(x) is -cos(x)
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I realize there's a bunch of similar questions, but for derivative. However, this is a little bit different.
I understand pretty well why derivative of sin(x)
is cos(x)
and of cos(x)
is -sin(x)
. That makes sense, since derivative expresses the "angle of normal", I can see that from graph easily.
However, when I try to - analogically, using a graph - find integral of sin(x), I can't seem to make sense of it.
Here's my graphs:
I know that integral is "area under graph". If you look at graph of sin(x)
, it starts with zero area under the graph and gradually more is added, with growing speed, then it slows down and eventually stops at PI, where the derivative reaches zero. Then as the graph goes under the X axis, the area is subtracted again and eventually it reaches zero at 2PI.
That doesn't quite add up with -cos(x)
, does it? It would make sense if it was as it's on my 3rd picture.
I probably understand it wrong, so please give me some hint how to understand it... the point is, I never remember the formulas, and I'm reasonably successful with finding the derivatives, but never get the integral right.
calculus trigonometry
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add a comment |
$begingroup$
I realize there's a bunch of similar questions, but for derivative. However, this is a little bit different.
I understand pretty well why derivative of sin(x)
is cos(x)
and of cos(x)
is -sin(x)
. That makes sense, since derivative expresses the "angle of normal", I can see that from graph easily.
However, when I try to - analogically, using a graph - find integral of sin(x), I can't seem to make sense of it.
Here's my graphs:
I know that integral is "area under graph". If you look at graph of sin(x)
, it starts with zero area under the graph and gradually more is added, with growing speed, then it slows down and eventually stops at PI, where the derivative reaches zero. Then as the graph goes under the X axis, the area is subtracted again and eventually it reaches zero at 2PI.
That doesn't quite add up with -cos(x)
, does it? It would make sense if it was as it's on my 3rd picture.
I probably understand it wrong, so please give me some hint how to understand it... the point is, I never remember the formulas, and I'm reasonably successful with finding the derivatives, but never get the integral right.
calculus trigonometry
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3
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Your third picture looks pretty much like $-cos$. Perhaps a bit of vertical translation would make them equal, eh?
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– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:20
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I suppose... so does that mean that the integration constant is1
then?
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:22
2
$begingroup$
You're talking about integrals and antiderivatives. So when you compare the "area under the graph" of $sin(x)$ from $[a,b]$ you are just looking at $-cos(b) + cos(a)$ rather than the area of the graph for the $-cos(x)$. Actually you should look up antiderivatives and the fundamental theorem of calculus and it will help you understand why the integrals must be that way. You could also look up the exponential form and series form of sin and cos
$endgroup$
– Rammus
Feb 5 '15 at 10:34
add a comment |
$begingroup$
I realize there's a bunch of similar questions, but for derivative. However, this is a little bit different.
I understand pretty well why derivative of sin(x)
is cos(x)
and of cos(x)
is -sin(x)
. That makes sense, since derivative expresses the "angle of normal", I can see that from graph easily.
However, when I try to - analogically, using a graph - find integral of sin(x), I can't seem to make sense of it.
Here's my graphs:
I know that integral is "area under graph". If you look at graph of sin(x)
, it starts with zero area under the graph and gradually more is added, with growing speed, then it slows down and eventually stops at PI, where the derivative reaches zero. Then as the graph goes under the X axis, the area is subtracted again and eventually it reaches zero at 2PI.
That doesn't quite add up with -cos(x)
, does it? It would make sense if it was as it's on my 3rd picture.
I probably understand it wrong, so please give me some hint how to understand it... the point is, I never remember the formulas, and I'm reasonably successful with finding the derivatives, but never get the integral right.
calculus trigonometry
$endgroup$
I realize there's a bunch of similar questions, but for derivative. However, this is a little bit different.
I understand pretty well why derivative of sin(x)
is cos(x)
and of cos(x)
is -sin(x)
. That makes sense, since derivative expresses the "angle of normal", I can see that from graph easily.
However, when I try to - analogically, using a graph - find integral of sin(x), I can't seem to make sense of it.
Here's my graphs:
I know that integral is "area under graph". If you look at graph of sin(x)
, it starts with zero area under the graph and gradually more is added, with growing speed, then it slows down and eventually stops at PI, where the derivative reaches zero. Then as the graph goes under the X axis, the area is subtracted again and eventually it reaches zero at 2PI.
That doesn't quite add up with -cos(x)
, does it? It would make sense if it was as it's on my 3rd picture.
I probably understand it wrong, so please give me some hint how to understand it... the point is, I never remember the formulas, and I'm reasonably successful with finding the derivatives, but never get the integral right.
calculus trigonometry
calculus trigonometry
asked Feb 5 '15 at 10:17
MightyPorkMightyPork
195212
195212
3
$begingroup$
Your third picture looks pretty much like $-cos$. Perhaps a bit of vertical translation would make them equal, eh?
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:20
$begingroup$
I suppose... so does that mean that the integration constant is1
then?
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:22
2
$begingroup$
You're talking about integrals and antiderivatives. So when you compare the "area under the graph" of $sin(x)$ from $[a,b]$ you are just looking at $-cos(b) + cos(a)$ rather than the area of the graph for the $-cos(x)$. Actually you should look up antiderivatives and the fundamental theorem of calculus and it will help you understand why the integrals must be that way. You could also look up the exponential form and series form of sin and cos
$endgroup$
– Rammus
Feb 5 '15 at 10:34
add a comment |
3
$begingroup$
Your third picture looks pretty much like $-cos$. Perhaps a bit of vertical translation would make them equal, eh?
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:20
$begingroup$
I suppose... so does that mean that the integration constant is1
then?
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:22
2
$begingroup$
You're talking about integrals and antiderivatives. So when you compare the "area under the graph" of $sin(x)$ from $[a,b]$ you are just looking at $-cos(b) + cos(a)$ rather than the area of the graph for the $-cos(x)$. Actually you should look up antiderivatives and the fundamental theorem of calculus and it will help you understand why the integrals must be that way. You could also look up the exponential form and series form of sin and cos
$endgroup$
– Rammus
Feb 5 '15 at 10:34
3
3
$begingroup$
Your third picture looks pretty much like $-cos$. Perhaps a bit of vertical translation would make them equal, eh?
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:20
$begingroup$
Your third picture looks pretty much like $-cos$. Perhaps a bit of vertical translation would make them equal, eh?
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:20
$begingroup$
I suppose... so does that mean that the integration constant is
1
then?$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:22
$begingroup$
I suppose... so does that mean that the integration constant is
1
then?$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:22
2
2
$begingroup$
You're talking about integrals and antiderivatives. So when you compare the "area under the graph" of $sin(x)$ from $[a,b]$ you are just looking at $-cos(b) + cos(a)$ rather than the area of the graph for the $-cos(x)$. Actually you should look up antiderivatives and the fundamental theorem of calculus and it will help you understand why the integrals must be that way. You could also look up the exponential form and series form of sin and cos
$endgroup$
– Rammus
Feb 5 '15 at 10:34
$begingroup$
You're talking about integrals and antiderivatives. So when you compare the "area under the graph" of $sin(x)$ from $[a,b]$ you are just looking at $-cos(b) + cos(a)$ rather than the area of the graph for the $-cos(x)$. Actually you should look up antiderivatives and the fundamental theorem of calculus and it will help you understand why the integrals must be that way. You could also look up the exponential form and series form of sin and cos
$endgroup$
– Rammus
Feb 5 '15 at 10:34
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
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When you talk about integrals, you could be talking about one of many distinct, but related topics. You could mean Riemann integrals, indefinite integrals, or many other types of integral out there.
You're probably talking about the indefinite integral when you say that the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$. The thing about the indefinite integral is that it is not really a single function. That's why you often display it with the little ${}+C$ at the end. An indefinite integral is more like a set of functions, which are all equal under vertical translations.
So, $int f$ could be considered the set of functions which have a derivative $f$. There are many functions which have the derivative $sin$, and they are all of the form $-cos+C$, where $C$ is some real number. This is why it is said the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$.
But why does the integral then not represent the area? Well, it does. What you were saying was that $-cos(x)$ should be the area under $sin(x)$ up to $x$. The question is, up to $x$ from where? There is no lower bound! If you pick the lower bound $0$, then
$$-cos(x)-(-cos(0))=-cos(x)+1$$
You get that $+1$ you were wondering about, and it does represent the area under $sin(x)$ from $0$ to $x$.
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This answer is far from perfect, but I hope it is of at least some use to you.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:37
$begingroup$
Yep it's a good explanation, just doesn't help much with "figuring out" it's-cos(x)
, like I can do for the derivative using the slope... I'll have to just remember it, I guess
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– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:39
1
$begingroup$
@MightyPork: You could try this: Do as you did when making your third image. Then imagine what function the graph could represent if you moved it up or down. For example, you may notice that moving your third image down by $1$ makes it look like $-cos$.
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– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:42
$begingroup$
that's good, thanks!
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are right as far as area goes but remember that the integral is only defined up to a constant!
Numerically if you were directly comparing areas then the function you would need would be $1-cos{x}$. However recall that this is indefinite integration.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
protected by Community♦ Dec 24 '18 at 16:32
Thank you for your interest in this question.
Because it has attracted low-quality or spam answers that had to be removed, posting an answer now requires 10 reputation on this site (the association bonus does not count).
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2 Answers
2
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
When you talk about integrals, you could be talking about one of many distinct, but related topics. You could mean Riemann integrals, indefinite integrals, or many other types of integral out there.
You're probably talking about the indefinite integral when you say that the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$. The thing about the indefinite integral is that it is not really a single function. That's why you often display it with the little ${}+C$ at the end. An indefinite integral is more like a set of functions, which are all equal under vertical translations.
So, $int f$ could be considered the set of functions which have a derivative $f$. There are many functions which have the derivative $sin$, and they are all of the form $-cos+C$, where $C$ is some real number. This is why it is said the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$.
But why does the integral then not represent the area? Well, it does. What you were saying was that $-cos(x)$ should be the area under $sin(x)$ up to $x$. The question is, up to $x$ from where? There is no lower bound! If you pick the lower bound $0$, then
$$-cos(x)-(-cos(0))=-cos(x)+1$$
You get that $+1$ you were wondering about, and it does represent the area under $sin(x)$ from $0$ to $x$.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
This answer is far from perfect, but I hope it is of at least some use to you.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:37
$begingroup$
Yep it's a good explanation, just doesn't help much with "figuring out" it's-cos(x)
, like I can do for the derivative using the slope... I'll have to just remember it, I guess
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:39
1
$begingroup$
@MightyPork: You could try this: Do as you did when making your third image. Then imagine what function the graph could represent if you moved it up or down. For example, you may notice that moving your third image down by $1$ makes it look like $-cos$.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:42
$begingroup$
that's good, thanks!
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When you talk about integrals, you could be talking about one of many distinct, but related topics. You could mean Riemann integrals, indefinite integrals, or many other types of integral out there.
You're probably talking about the indefinite integral when you say that the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$. The thing about the indefinite integral is that it is not really a single function. That's why you often display it with the little ${}+C$ at the end. An indefinite integral is more like a set of functions, which are all equal under vertical translations.
So, $int f$ could be considered the set of functions which have a derivative $f$. There are many functions which have the derivative $sin$, and they are all of the form $-cos+C$, where $C$ is some real number. This is why it is said the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$.
But why does the integral then not represent the area? Well, it does. What you were saying was that $-cos(x)$ should be the area under $sin(x)$ up to $x$. The question is, up to $x$ from where? There is no lower bound! If you pick the lower bound $0$, then
$$-cos(x)-(-cos(0))=-cos(x)+1$$
You get that $+1$ you were wondering about, and it does represent the area under $sin(x)$ from $0$ to $x$.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
This answer is far from perfect, but I hope it is of at least some use to you.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:37
$begingroup$
Yep it's a good explanation, just doesn't help much with "figuring out" it's-cos(x)
, like I can do for the derivative using the slope... I'll have to just remember it, I guess
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:39
1
$begingroup$
@MightyPork: You could try this: Do as you did when making your third image. Then imagine what function the graph could represent if you moved it up or down. For example, you may notice that moving your third image down by $1$ makes it look like $-cos$.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:42
$begingroup$
that's good, thanks!
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When you talk about integrals, you could be talking about one of many distinct, but related topics. You could mean Riemann integrals, indefinite integrals, or many other types of integral out there.
You're probably talking about the indefinite integral when you say that the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$. The thing about the indefinite integral is that it is not really a single function. That's why you often display it with the little ${}+C$ at the end. An indefinite integral is more like a set of functions, which are all equal under vertical translations.
So, $int f$ could be considered the set of functions which have a derivative $f$. There are many functions which have the derivative $sin$, and they are all of the form $-cos+C$, where $C$ is some real number. This is why it is said the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$.
But why does the integral then not represent the area? Well, it does. What you were saying was that $-cos(x)$ should be the area under $sin(x)$ up to $x$. The question is, up to $x$ from where? There is no lower bound! If you pick the lower bound $0$, then
$$-cos(x)-(-cos(0))=-cos(x)+1$$
You get that $+1$ you were wondering about, and it does represent the area under $sin(x)$ from $0$ to $x$.
$endgroup$
When you talk about integrals, you could be talking about one of many distinct, but related topics. You could mean Riemann integrals, indefinite integrals, or many other types of integral out there.
You're probably talking about the indefinite integral when you say that the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$. The thing about the indefinite integral is that it is not really a single function. That's why you often display it with the little ${}+C$ at the end. An indefinite integral is more like a set of functions, which are all equal under vertical translations.
So, $int f$ could be considered the set of functions which have a derivative $f$. There are many functions which have the derivative $sin$, and they are all of the form $-cos+C$, where $C$ is some real number. This is why it is said the integral of $sin$ is $-cos$.
But why does the integral then not represent the area? Well, it does. What you were saying was that $-cos(x)$ should be the area under $sin(x)$ up to $x$. The question is, up to $x$ from where? There is no lower bound! If you pick the lower bound $0$, then
$$-cos(x)-(-cos(0))=-cos(x)+1$$
You get that $+1$ you were wondering about, and it does represent the area under $sin(x)$ from $0$ to $x$.
edited Feb 5 '15 at 10:43
answered Feb 5 '15 at 10:35
RegretRegret
3,6071925
3,6071925
$begingroup$
This answer is far from perfect, but I hope it is of at least some use to you.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:37
$begingroup$
Yep it's a good explanation, just doesn't help much with "figuring out" it's-cos(x)
, like I can do for the derivative using the slope... I'll have to just remember it, I guess
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:39
1
$begingroup$
@MightyPork: You could try this: Do as you did when making your third image. Then imagine what function the graph could represent if you moved it up or down. For example, you may notice that moving your third image down by $1$ makes it look like $-cos$.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:42
$begingroup$
that's good, thanks!
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
This answer is far from perfect, but I hope it is of at least some use to you.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:37
$begingroup$
Yep it's a good explanation, just doesn't help much with "figuring out" it's-cos(x)
, like I can do for the derivative using the slope... I'll have to just remember it, I guess
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:39
1
$begingroup$
@MightyPork: You could try this: Do as you did when making your third image. Then imagine what function the graph could represent if you moved it up or down. For example, you may notice that moving your third image down by $1$ makes it look like $-cos$.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:42
$begingroup$
that's good, thanks!
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:45
$begingroup$
This answer is far from perfect, but I hope it is of at least some use to you.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:37
$begingroup$
This answer is far from perfect, but I hope it is of at least some use to you.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:37
$begingroup$
Yep it's a good explanation, just doesn't help much with "figuring out" it's
-cos(x)
, like I can do for the derivative using the slope... I'll have to just remember it, I guess$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:39
$begingroup$
Yep it's a good explanation, just doesn't help much with "figuring out" it's
-cos(x)
, like I can do for the derivative using the slope... I'll have to just remember it, I guess$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:39
1
1
$begingroup$
@MightyPork: You could try this: Do as you did when making your third image. Then imagine what function the graph could represent if you moved it up or down. For example, you may notice that moving your third image down by $1$ makes it look like $-cos$.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:42
$begingroup$
@MightyPork: You could try this: Do as you did when making your third image. Then imagine what function the graph could represent if you moved it up or down. For example, you may notice that moving your third image down by $1$ makes it look like $-cos$.
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:42
$begingroup$
that's good, thanks!
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:45
$begingroup$
that's good, thanks!
$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are right as far as area goes but remember that the integral is only defined up to a constant!
Numerically if you were directly comparing areas then the function you would need would be $1-cos{x}$. However recall that this is indefinite integration.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are right as far as area goes but remember that the integral is only defined up to a constant!
Numerically if you were directly comparing areas then the function you would need would be $1-cos{x}$. However recall that this is indefinite integration.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are right as far as area goes but remember that the integral is only defined up to a constant!
Numerically if you were directly comparing areas then the function you would need would be $1-cos{x}$. However recall that this is indefinite integration.
$endgroup$
You are right as far as area goes but remember that the integral is only defined up to a constant!
Numerically if you were directly comparing areas then the function you would need would be $1-cos{x}$. However recall that this is indefinite integration.
answered Feb 5 '15 at 10:41
frettyfretty
8,5631431
8,5631431
add a comment |
add a comment |
protected by Community♦ Dec 24 '18 at 16:32
Thank you for your interest in this question.
Because it has attracted low-quality or spam answers that had to be removed, posting an answer now requires 10 reputation on this site (the association bonus does not count).
Would you like to answer one of these unanswered questions instead?
3
$begingroup$
Your third picture looks pretty much like $-cos$. Perhaps a bit of vertical translation would make them equal, eh?
$endgroup$
– Regret
Feb 5 '15 at 10:20
$begingroup$
I suppose... so does that mean that the integration constant is
1
then?$endgroup$
– MightyPork
Feb 5 '15 at 10:22
2
$begingroup$
You're talking about integrals and antiderivatives. So when you compare the "area under the graph" of $sin(x)$ from $[a,b]$ you are just looking at $-cos(b) + cos(a)$ rather than the area of the graph for the $-cos(x)$. Actually you should look up antiderivatives and the fundamental theorem of calculus and it will help you understand why the integrals must be that way. You could also look up the exponential form and series form of sin and cos
$endgroup$
– Rammus
Feb 5 '15 at 10:34