I lost my closet key, how to open it?











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I lost the key to a closet and I need to open it. I don't need for the lock to remain opperative after the opperation, so I accept "radical" solutions.



The key is of this type:



keys



I have no experience or tools for lockpicking.
Any ideas?



Edit:
I was not able to open it yet. I am adding pictures of the actual door and lock



keyholedoor with hinges, keyhole, and doorknob










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  • 3




    You might want to firm up your question. I don't think "sawzall" is the answer you want but the question just about screams "sawzall" to me.
    – Joshua
    yesterday










  • @Joshua I do not own a sawzall and do not plan to buy one, so it is not an option. Thanks for the suggestion
    – Guillermo Vasconcelos
    yesterday










  • We really need a picture of the lock and the door. Not just the key. Not being familiar with US English, I'm not sure what you mean by 'closet'. Is it built into the wall or is it free-standing?
    – chasly from UK
    18 hours ago










  • The door hinges are designed so that the door would be removed by opening it and then lifting it off the hinges, rather than by removing the hinge pin. The lighting of the picture is not very good, but the appearance is consistent with either a crude warded lock or a crude lever lock. Does the keyhole extend all the way through the door? If so, and you can get a dowel the right diameter to serve as the shaft of the key, you might try putting a small finishing nail in the side of it (maybe an inch from the end), extending out about as far as a key would go, and then...
    – supercat
    13 hours ago










  • ...inserting it to different depths and turning it to see whether you feel spring-loaded levers or rigid warding.
    – supercat
    13 hours ago















up vote
13
down vote

favorite












I lost the key to a closet and I need to open it. I don't need for the lock to remain opperative after the opperation, so I accept "radical" solutions.



The key is of this type:



keys



I have no experience or tools for lockpicking.
Any ideas?



Edit:
I was not able to open it yet. I am adding pictures of the actual door and lock



keyholedoor with hinges, keyhole, and doorknob










share|improve this question









New contributor




Guillermo Vasconcelos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
















  • 3




    You might want to firm up your question. I don't think "sawzall" is the answer you want but the question just about screams "sawzall" to me.
    – Joshua
    yesterday










  • @Joshua I do not own a sawzall and do not plan to buy one, so it is not an option. Thanks for the suggestion
    – Guillermo Vasconcelos
    yesterday










  • We really need a picture of the lock and the door. Not just the key. Not being familiar with US English, I'm not sure what you mean by 'closet'. Is it built into the wall or is it free-standing?
    – chasly from UK
    18 hours ago










  • The door hinges are designed so that the door would be removed by opening it and then lifting it off the hinges, rather than by removing the hinge pin. The lighting of the picture is not very good, but the appearance is consistent with either a crude warded lock or a crude lever lock. Does the keyhole extend all the way through the door? If so, and you can get a dowel the right diameter to serve as the shaft of the key, you might try putting a small finishing nail in the side of it (maybe an inch from the end), extending out about as far as a key would go, and then...
    – supercat
    13 hours ago










  • ...inserting it to different depths and turning it to see whether you feel spring-loaded levers or rigid warding.
    – supercat
    13 hours ago













up vote
13
down vote

favorite









up vote
13
down vote

favorite











I lost the key to a closet and I need to open it. I don't need for the lock to remain opperative after the opperation, so I accept "radical" solutions.



The key is of this type:



keys



I have no experience or tools for lockpicking.
Any ideas?



Edit:
I was not able to open it yet. I am adding pictures of the actual door and lock



keyholedoor with hinges, keyhole, and doorknob










share|improve this question









New contributor




Guillermo Vasconcelos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.











I lost the key to a closet and I need to open it. I don't need for the lock to remain opperative after the opperation, so I accept "radical" solutions.



The key is of this type:



keys



I have no experience or tools for lockpicking.
Any ideas?



Edit:
I was not able to open it yet. I am adding pictures of the actual door and lock



keyholedoor with hinges, keyhole, and doorknob







locks






share|improve this question









New contributor




Guillermo Vasconcelos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.











share|improve this question









New contributor




Guillermo Vasconcelos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.









share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 10 hours ago









sondra.kinsey

1032




1032






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asked yesterday









Guillermo Vasconcelos

16617




16617




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New contributor





Guillermo Vasconcelos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






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Check out our Code of Conduct.








  • 3




    You might want to firm up your question. I don't think "sawzall" is the answer you want but the question just about screams "sawzall" to me.
    – Joshua
    yesterday










  • @Joshua I do not own a sawzall and do not plan to buy one, so it is not an option. Thanks for the suggestion
    – Guillermo Vasconcelos
    yesterday










  • We really need a picture of the lock and the door. Not just the key. Not being familiar with US English, I'm not sure what you mean by 'closet'. Is it built into the wall or is it free-standing?
    – chasly from UK
    18 hours ago










  • The door hinges are designed so that the door would be removed by opening it and then lifting it off the hinges, rather than by removing the hinge pin. The lighting of the picture is not very good, but the appearance is consistent with either a crude warded lock or a crude lever lock. Does the keyhole extend all the way through the door? If so, and you can get a dowel the right diameter to serve as the shaft of the key, you might try putting a small finishing nail in the side of it (maybe an inch from the end), extending out about as far as a key would go, and then...
    – supercat
    13 hours ago










  • ...inserting it to different depths and turning it to see whether you feel spring-loaded levers or rigid warding.
    – supercat
    13 hours ago














  • 3




    You might want to firm up your question. I don't think "sawzall" is the answer you want but the question just about screams "sawzall" to me.
    – Joshua
    yesterday










  • @Joshua I do not own a sawzall and do not plan to buy one, so it is not an option. Thanks for the suggestion
    – Guillermo Vasconcelos
    yesterday










  • We really need a picture of the lock and the door. Not just the key. Not being familiar with US English, I'm not sure what you mean by 'closet'. Is it built into the wall or is it free-standing?
    – chasly from UK
    18 hours ago










  • The door hinges are designed so that the door would be removed by opening it and then lifting it off the hinges, rather than by removing the hinge pin. The lighting of the picture is not very good, but the appearance is consistent with either a crude warded lock or a crude lever lock. Does the keyhole extend all the way through the door? If so, and you can get a dowel the right diameter to serve as the shaft of the key, you might try putting a small finishing nail in the side of it (maybe an inch from the end), extending out about as far as a key would go, and then...
    – supercat
    13 hours ago










  • ...inserting it to different depths and turning it to see whether you feel spring-loaded levers or rigid warding.
    – supercat
    13 hours ago








3




3




You might want to firm up your question. I don't think "sawzall" is the answer you want but the question just about screams "sawzall" to me.
– Joshua
yesterday




You might want to firm up your question. I don't think "sawzall" is the answer you want but the question just about screams "sawzall" to me.
– Joshua
yesterday












@Joshua I do not own a sawzall and do not plan to buy one, so it is not an option. Thanks for the suggestion
– Guillermo Vasconcelos
yesterday




@Joshua I do not own a sawzall and do not plan to buy one, so it is not an option. Thanks for the suggestion
– Guillermo Vasconcelos
yesterday












We really need a picture of the lock and the door. Not just the key. Not being familiar with US English, I'm not sure what you mean by 'closet'. Is it built into the wall or is it free-standing?
– chasly from UK
18 hours ago




We really need a picture of the lock and the door. Not just the key. Not being familiar with US English, I'm not sure what you mean by 'closet'. Is it built into the wall or is it free-standing?
– chasly from UK
18 hours ago












The door hinges are designed so that the door would be removed by opening it and then lifting it off the hinges, rather than by removing the hinge pin. The lighting of the picture is not very good, but the appearance is consistent with either a crude warded lock or a crude lever lock. Does the keyhole extend all the way through the door? If so, and you can get a dowel the right diameter to serve as the shaft of the key, you might try putting a small finishing nail in the side of it (maybe an inch from the end), extending out about as far as a key would go, and then...
– supercat
13 hours ago




The door hinges are designed so that the door would be removed by opening it and then lifting it off the hinges, rather than by removing the hinge pin. The lighting of the picture is not very good, but the appearance is consistent with either a crude warded lock or a crude lever lock. Does the keyhole extend all the way through the door? If so, and you can get a dowel the right diameter to serve as the shaft of the key, you might try putting a small finishing nail in the side of it (maybe an inch from the end), extending out about as far as a key would go, and then...
– supercat
13 hours ago












...inserting it to different depths and turning it to see whether you feel spring-loaded levers or rigid warding.
– supercat
13 hours ago




...inserting it to different depths and turning it to see whether you feel spring-loaded levers or rigid warding.
– supercat
13 hours ago










7 Answers
7






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oldest

votes

















up vote
25
down vote













Very few if any closets open inward -- which means the hinges will have their pins on the accessible side. Just drive the pins out of the hinges, and the entire door can be pulled out of the frame (and easily put back once the lock is either opened, replaced, or the key found and duplicated).



If the pins are peened in place, a tool like a Dremel could be used to cut one head off so the pin can be removed.






share|improve this answer

















  • 2




    Thinking outside the "closet"... just remove the door +1
    – Nelson
    yesterday






  • 3




    Why do you think the hinges would be outside when it opens to the outside? My closet has the hinge systems on the inside, but the doors open to the outside
    – Ferrybig
    22 hours ago






  • 1




    @Ferrybig a picture of the closet in the question would help. If it uses standard hinges, then they will be on the outside. (Butt, butterfly, etc) A barrel or concealed hinge will of course not have an outside hinge. Given the key, it's an older cabinet (so not a concealed hinge) which leaves the very common butt hinge, or comparatively rare barrel hinge, so it's a good bet that the hinge in this case is external.
    – Baldrickk
    19 hours ago








  • 1




    @Ferrybig Zeiss is probably assuming that because that's how the vast majority of doors work. It would take a non-standard hinge for doors to open on the opposite side. Something like that would not normally be done for something like an closet.
    – Kevin
    17 hours ago






  • 4




    Now that a picture has been added, it's clear that the type of hinges used do not have pins that can be removed, but this is still and answer that could help someone else.
    – JPhi1618
    14 hours ago


















up vote
12
down vote













I should suggest trying a bobbypin or a smaller flathead screwdriver if you'd like to save it. From my experience, these types of locks are very easily opened, even with almost no skill in lockpicking. After all, you might find the key again.



Another option could be to drill out the center of the lock, therein making it very easy to open the door. This would, of course, entirely destroy the lock, but you have already said this is not an issue.






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  • 1




    I was maybe 10 years old and grandma used to store chocolates and condensed milk on a closet with a similar key/lock. It was easy to open and close it with a strong paper clip :)
    – brasofilo
    6 hours ago




















up vote
11
down vote













Vintage locks employed two concepts, sometimes individually and sometimes together.



A warded lock has structures within the lock, called warding, which are designed to fit in notches carved into the key. A quality warded lock will be constructed so that the only way for a key to reach the mechanism is for it to snake around some complicated warding, but many cheaper warded locks can be opened with a skeleton key, which is a key blank that is filed down to remove everything except one or two simple projections or pairs of projections that will operate the mechanism. The way to defeat a quality warded lock is to construct a key by starting with a suitable key blank, covering it with soot or similar material, attempting to open the lock, moving the key back and forth a little at the place it is blocked, carefully removing it, and looking for markings in the soot. Cut, file, or otherwise remove the parts of the key where the soot was marked by the warding and try again. Either the lock will open, or new markings will appear, which again need to be removed. This process can sometimes be slow and tedious, but one will end up with a usable key, greatly increasing the value of the lock to a collector.



Lever locks have one or more levers that must be lifted to the correct height to allow the bolt to move. Lever locks will often have a different feel from warded locks, since warded locks will usually block the key before it has a chance to engage the mechanism, while lever locks will allow the key to engage the mechanism but will block the mechanism from moving fully unless the levers are lifted to the correct height. Many lever locks can be picked relatively easily with the proper tools, but picking would require using a pair of tools, with one being used to try to operate the mechanism which is blocked by the levers, while the other tool is used to try lifting the levers. Often, there will initially be one lever blocking the bolt; once that lever is moved to the right position (i.e. "set"), the bolt will be able to move a little bit before being blocked by another lever. If the bolt is kept under tension, this will rather conveniently hold the first lever in place while the picker focuses attention on the next lever that needs to be set.



The best locks combine these two approaches, requiring intricately-cut keys which need to move several different levers simultaneously by relatively precise amounts. Such locks are much more expensive to manufacture than current designs. Although they may be as secure or even more so than most recent locks, the additional security they offer is not sufficient to justify their cost.



I would not expect a closet door to have a particularly high-quality lock. If the lock uses warding to distinguish correct and incorrect keys, picking with crude tools may be easy. If it uses levers for that purpose, picking will require the simultaneous use of two tools that are designed to work together. There are many youtube videos and web tutorials that would explain how to make the required tools. If you can find some old keys that look like they would fit, I would suggest trying them and seeing what happens. If the key is blocked by something in the lock without engaging a mechanism, you probably have a warded lock. If the key engages the mechanism but the mechanism itself feels blocked, it's probably a lever lock.






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    up vote
    7
    down vote













    Other suggested methods of removing the hinge pins or picking the locks are good.



    You can also try to depress the latch via a thin wire if the door opens out or a thin plastic card if the door opens inward. What you goal would be is to depress the latch as if the door were closing on its own.






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    • 2




      This is what used to be call "jimmying" the door, then later came be "carding" the lock. Works well for simple locksets intended for interior doors.
      – Zeiss Ikon
      yesterday






    • 3




      That won't work because it is a deadbolt, not the ones with a spring
      – Guillermo Vasconcelos
      yesterday










    • @GuillermoVasconcelos - yes my suggestion would not work then, picking seems like the best bet.
      – Gary Bak
      17 hours ago










    • In BrE, a "jimmy" (or "jemmy") is usually a crowbar; it's not even vaguely the same as using a wire or card on the latch.
      – Roger Lipscombe
      15 hours ago










    • @RogerLipscombe Can't talk to older history, but when I was a kid, a jimmy was what later became a "slim jim" -- mainly for opening car doors when the key was locked inside. Thin and flexible. Still won't work on a deadbolt, though.
      – Zeiss Ikon
      10 hours ago


















    up vote
    5
    down vote













    The original image of the key is interesting to me. You could just wander into the local locksmith and ask if they have a set of keys that might fit. There's a limited number of variants on these keys and you may just be able to buy one off the shelf as the lock is only a token gesture towards security.



    If you're not overly attached to the lock, there's the question of how firmly it's attached. many cabinet locks are lightly attached to the inside of the door and if you attach a decent handle to the outside you could possibly just force it open. Though the hinges are quite heavy duty which implies a more solid door and lock mechanism.






    share|improve this answer




























      up vote
      0
      down vote













      Well, if you don't care about locking it again, I'd find my trusty old Fein multimaster cutter and just cut the lock open. Or if you want the gentle solution use a small hacksaw blade.






      share|improve this answer




























        up vote
        0
        down vote













        Use a punch and hammer. Insert the punch where the key would go...use the hammer to drive the lock mechanism off the back of the door. A couple of good whacks and you should be wide open. Shame to bust it though..I would try the bobby pin method first.






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          7 Answers
          7






          active

          oldest

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          7 Answers
          7






          active

          oldest

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          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

          votes








          up vote
          25
          down vote













          Very few if any closets open inward -- which means the hinges will have their pins on the accessible side. Just drive the pins out of the hinges, and the entire door can be pulled out of the frame (and easily put back once the lock is either opened, replaced, or the key found and duplicated).



          If the pins are peened in place, a tool like a Dremel could be used to cut one head off so the pin can be removed.






          share|improve this answer

















          • 2




            Thinking outside the "closet"... just remove the door +1
            – Nelson
            yesterday






          • 3




            Why do you think the hinges would be outside when it opens to the outside? My closet has the hinge systems on the inside, but the doors open to the outside
            – Ferrybig
            22 hours ago






          • 1




            @Ferrybig a picture of the closet in the question would help. If it uses standard hinges, then they will be on the outside. (Butt, butterfly, etc) A barrel or concealed hinge will of course not have an outside hinge. Given the key, it's an older cabinet (so not a concealed hinge) which leaves the very common butt hinge, or comparatively rare barrel hinge, so it's a good bet that the hinge in this case is external.
            – Baldrickk
            19 hours ago








          • 1




            @Ferrybig Zeiss is probably assuming that because that's how the vast majority of doors work. It would take a non-standard hinge for doors to open on the opposite side. Something like that would not normally be done for something like an closet.
            – Kevin
            17 hours ago






          • 4




            Now that a picture has been added, it's clear that the type of hinges used do not have pins that can be removed, but this is still and answer that could help someone else.
            – JPhi1618
            14 hours ago















          up vote
          25
          down vote













          Very few if any closets open inward -- which means the hinges will have their pins on the accessible side. Just drive the pins out of the hinges, and the entire door can be pulled out of the frame (and easily put back once the lock is either opened, replaced, or the key found and duplicated).



          If the pins are peened in place, a tool like a Dremel could be used to cut one head off so the pin can be removed.






          share|improve this answer

















          • 2




            Thinking outside the "closet"... just remove the door +1
            – Nelson
            yesterday






          • 3




            Why do you think the hinges would be outside when it opens to the outside? My closet has the hinge systems on the inside, but the doors open to the outside
            – Ferrybig
            22 hours ago






          • 1




            @Ferrybig a picture of the closet in the question would help. If it uses standard hinges, then they will be on the outside. (Butt, butterfly, etc) A barrel or concealed hinge will of course not have an outside hinge. Given the key, it's an older cabinet (so not a concealed hinge) which leaves the very common butt hinge, or comparatively rare barrel hinge, so it's a good bet that the hinge in this case is external.
            – Baldrickk
            19 hours ago








          • 1




            @Ferrybig Zeiss is probably assuming that because that's how the vast majority of doors work. It would take a non-standard hinge for doors to open on the opposite side. Something like that would not normally be done for something like an closet.
            – Kevin
            17 hours ago






          • 4




            Now that a picture has been added, it's clear that the type of hinges used do not have pins that can be removed, but this is still and answer that could help someone else.
            – JPhi1618
            14 hours ago













          up vote
          25
          down vote










          up vote
          25
          down vote









          Very few if any closets open inward -- which means the hinges will have their pins on the accessible side. Just drive the pins out of the hinges, and the entire door can be pulled out of the frame (and easily put back once the lock is either opened, replaced, or the key found and duplicated).



          If the pins are peened in place, a tool like a Dremel could be used to cut one head off so the pin can be removed.






          share|improve this answer












          Very few if any closets open inward -- which means the hinges will have their pins on the accessible side. Just drive the pins out of the hinges, and the entire door can be pulled out of the frame (and easily put back once the lock is either opened, replaced, or the key found and duplicated).



          If the pins are peened in place, a tool like a Dremel could be used to cut one head off so the pin can be removed.







          share|improve this answer












          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered yesterday









          Zeiss Ikon

          7,032728




          7,032728








          • 2




            Thinking outside the "closet"... just remove the door +1
            – Nelson
            yesterday






          • 3




            Why do you think the hinges would be outside when it opens to the outside? My closet has the hinge systems on the inside, but the doors open to the outside
            – Ferrybig
            22 hours ago






          • 1




            @Ferrybig a picture of the closet in the question would help. If it uses standard hinges, then they will be on the outside. (Butt, butterfly, etc) A barrel or concealed hinge will of course not have an outside hinge. Given the key, it's an older cabinet (so not a concealed hinge) which leaves the very common butt hinge, or comparatively rare barrel hinge, so it's a good bet that the hinge in this case is external.
            – Baldrickk
            19 hours ago








          • 1




            @Ferrybig Zeiss is probably assuming that because that's how the vast majority of doors work. It would take a non-standard hinge for doors to open on the opposite side. Something like that would not normally be done for something like an closet.
            – Kevin
            17 hours ago






          • 4




            Now that a picture has been added, it's clear that the type of hinges used do not have pins that can be removed, but this is still and answer that could help someone else.
            – JPhi1618
            14 hours ago














          • 2




            Thinking outside the "closet"... just remove the door +1
            – Nelson
            yesterday






          • 3




            Why do you think the hinges would be outside when it opens to the outside? My closet has the hinge systems on the inside, but the doors open to the outside
            – Ferrybig
            22 hours ago






          • 1




            @Ferrybig a picture of the closet in the question would help. If it uses standard hinges, then they will be on the outside. (Butt, butterfly, etc) A barrel or concealed hinge will of course not have an outside hinge. Given the key, it's an older cabinet (so not a concealed hinge) which leaves the very common butt hinge, or comparatively rare barrel hinge, so it's a good bet that the hinge in this case is external.
            – Baldrickk
            19 hours ago








          • 1




            @Ferrybig Zeiss is probably assuming that because that's how the vast majority of doors work. It would take a non-standard hinge for doors to open on the opposite side. Something like that would not normally be done for something like an closet.
            – Kevin
            17 hours ago






          • 4




            Now that a picture has been added, it's clear that the type of hinges used do not have pins that can be removed, but this is still and answer that could help someone else.
            – JPhi1618
            14 hours ago








          2




          2




          Thinking outside the "closet"... just remove the door +1
          – Nelson
          yesterday




          Thinking outside the "closet"... just remove the door +1
          – Nelson
          yesterday




          3




          3




          Why do you think the hinges would be outside when it opens to the outside? My closet has the hinge systems on the inside, but the doors open to the outside
          – Ferrybig
          22 hours ago




          Why do you think the hinges would be outside when it opens to the outside? My closet has the hinge systems on the inside, but the doors open to the outside
          – Ferrybig
          22 hours ago




          1




          1




          @Ferrybig a picture of the closet in the question would help. If it uses standard hinges, then they will be on the outside. (Butt, butterfly, etc) A barrel or concealed hinge will of course not have an outside hinge. Given the key, it's an older cabinet (so not a concealed hinge) which leaves the very common butt hinge, or comparatively rare barrel hinge, so it's a good bet that the hinge in this case is external.
          – Baldrickk
          19 hours ago






          @Ferrybig a picture of the closet in the question would help. If it uses standard hinges, then they will be on the outside. (Butt, butterfly, etc) A barrel or concealed hinge will of course not have an outside hinge. Given the key, it's an older cabinet (so not a concealed hinge) which leaves the very common butt hinge, or comparatively rare barrel hinge, so it's a good bet that the hinge in this case is external.
          – Baldrickk
          19 hours ago






          1




          1




          @Ferrybig Zeiss is probably assuming that because that's how the vast majority of doors work. It would take a non-standard hinge for doors to open on the opposite side. Something like that would not normally be done for something like an closet.
          – Kevin
          17 hours ago




          @Ferrybig Zeiss is probably assuming that because that's how the vast majority of doors work. It would take a non-standard hinge for doors to open on the opposite side. Something like that would not normally be done for something like an closet.
          – Kevin
          17 hours ago




          4




          4




          Now that a picture has been added, it's clear that the type of hinges used do not have pins that can be removed, but this is still and answer that could help someone else.
          – JPhi1618
          14 hours ago




          Now that a picture has been added, it's clear that the type of hinges used do not have pins that can be removed, but this is still and answer that could help someone else.
          – JPhi1618
          14 hours ago










          up vote
          12
          down vote













          I should suggest trying a bobbypin or a smaller flathead screwdriver if you'd like to save it. From my experience, these types of locks are very easily opened, even with almost no skill in lockpicking. After all, you might find the key again.



          Another option could be to drill out the center of the lock, therein making it very easy to open the door. This would, of course, entirely destroy the lock, but you have already said this is not an issue.






          share|improve this answer








          New contributor




          Paul Beverage is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.














          • 1




            I was maybe 10 years old and grandma used to store chocolates and condensed milk on a closet with a similar key/lock. It was easy to open and close it with a strong paper clip :)
            – brasofilo
            6 hours ago

















          up vote
          12
          down vote













          I should suggest trying a bobbypin or a smaller flathead screwdriver if you'd like to save it. From my experience, these types of locks are very easily opened, even with almost no skill in lockpicking. After all, you might find the key again.



          Another option could be to drill out the center of the lock, therein making it very easy to open the door. This would, of course, entirely destroy the lock, but you have already said this is not an issue.






          share|improve this answer








          New contributor




          Paul Beverage is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.














          • 1




            I was maybe 10 years old and grandma used to store chocolates and condensed milk on a closet with a similar key/lock. It was easy to open and close it with a strong paper clip :)
            – brasofilo
            6 hours ago















          up vote
          12
          down vote










          up vote
          12
          down vote









          I should suggest trying a bobbypin or a smaller flathead screwdriver if you'd like to save it. From my experience, these types of locks are very easily opened, even with almost no skill in lockpicking. After all, you might find the key again.



          Another option could be to drill out the center of the lock, therein making it very easy to open the door. This would, of course, entirely destroy the lock, but you have already said this is not an issue.






          share|improve this answer








          New contributor




          Paul Beverage is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.









          I should suggest trying a bobbypin or a smaller flathead screwdriver if you'd like to save it. From my experience, these types of locks are very easily opened, even with almost no skill in lockpicking. After all, you might find the key again.



          Another option could be to drill out the center of the lock, therein making it very easy to open the door. This would, of course, entirely destroy the lock, but you have already said this is not an issue.







          share|improve this answer








          New contributor




          Paul Beverage is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.









          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer






          New contributor




          Paul Beverage is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.









          answered yesterday









          Paul Beverage

          2414




          2414




          New contributor




          Paul Beverage is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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          New contributor





          Paul Beverage is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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          • 1




            I was maybe 10 years old and grandma used to store chocolates and condensed milk on a closet with a similar key/lock. It was easy to open and close it with a strong paper clip :)
            – brasofilo
            6 hours ago
















          • 1




            I was maybe 10 years old and grandma used to store chocolates and condensed milk on a closet with a similar key/lock. It was easy to open and close it with a strong paper clip :)
            – brasofilo
            6 hours ago










          1




          1




          I was maybe 10 years old and grandma used to store chocolates and condensed milk on a closet with a similar key/lock. It was easy to open and close it with a strong paper clip :)
          – brasofilo
          6 hours ago






          I was maybe 10 years old and grandma used to store chocolates and condensed milk on a closet with a similar key/lock. It was easy to open and close it with a strong paper clip :)
          – brasofilo
          6 hours ago












          up vote
          11
          down vote













          Vintage locks employed two concepts, sometimes individually and sometimes together.



          A warded lock has structures within the lock, called warding, which are designed to fit in notches carved into the key. A quality warded lock will be constructed so that the only way for a key to reach the mechanism is for it to snake around some complicated warding, but many cheaper warded locks can be opened with a skeleton key, which is a key blank that is filed down to remove everything except one or two simple projections or pairs of projections that will operate the mechanism. The way to defeat a quality warded lock is to construct a key by starting with a suitable key blank, covering it with soot or similar material, attempting to open the lock, moving the key back and forth a little at the place it is blocked, carefully removing it, and looking for markings in the soot. Cut, file, or otherwise remove the parts of the key where the soot was marked by the warding and try again. Either the lock will open, or new markings will appear, which again need to be removed. This process can sometimes be slow and tedious, but one will end up with a usable key, greatly increasing the value of the lock to a collector.



          Lever locks have one or more levers that must be lifted to the correct height to allow the bolt to move. Lever locks will often have a different feel from warded locks, since warded locks will usually block the key before it has a chance to engage the mechanism, while lever locks will allow the key to engage the mechanism but will block the mechanism from moving fully unless the levers are lifted to the correct height. Many lever locks can be picked relatively easily with the proper tools, but picking would require using a pair of tools, with one being used to try to operate the mechanism which is blocked by the levers, while the other tool is used to try lifting the levers. Often, there will initially be one lever blocking the bolt; once that lever is moved to the right position (i.e. "set"), the bolt will be able to move a little bit before being blocked by another lever. If the bolt is kept under tension, this will rather conveniently hold the first lever in place while the picker focuses attention on the next lever that needs to be set.



          The best locks combine these two approaches, requiring intricately-cut keys which need to move several different levers simultaneously by relatively precise amounts. Such locks are much more expensive to manufacture than current designs. Although they may be as secure or even more so than most recent locks, the additional security they offer is not sufficient to justify their cost.



          I would not expect a closet door to have a particularly high-quality lock. If the lock uses warding to distinguish correct and incorrect keys, picking with crude tools may be easy. If it uses levers for that purpose, picking will require the simultaneous use of two tools that are designed to work together. There are many youtube videos and web tutorials that would explain how to make the required tools. If you can find some old keys that look like they would fit, I would suggest trying them and seeing what happens. If the key is blocked by something in the lock without engaging a mechanism, you probably have a warded lock. If the key engages the mechanism but the mechanism itself feels blocked, it's probably a lever lock.






          share|improve this answer








          New contributor




          supercat is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.






















            up vote
            11
            down vote













            Vintage locks employed two concepts, sometimes individually and sometimes together.



            A warded lock has structures within the lock, called warding, which are designed to fit in notches carved into the key. A quality warded lock will be constructed so that the only way for a key to reach the mechanism is for it to snake around some complicated warding, but many cheaper warded locks can be opened with a skeleton key, which is a key blank that is filed down to remove everything except one or two simple projections or pairs of projections that will operate the mechanism. The way to defeat a quality warded lock is to construct a key by starting with a suitable key blank, covering it with soot or similar material, attempting to open the lock, moving the key back and forth a little at the place it is blocked, carefully removing it, and looking for markings in the soot. Cut, file, or otherwise remove the parts of the key where the soot was marked by the warding and try again. Either the lock will open, or new markings will appear, which again need to be removed. This process can sometimes be slow and tedious, but one will end up with a usable key, greatly increasing the value of the lock to a collector.



            Lever locks have one or more levers that must be lifted to the correct height to allow the bolt to move. Lever locks will often have a different feel from warded locks, since warded locks will usually block the key before it has a chance to engage the mechanism, while lever locks will allow the key to engage the mechanism but will block the mechanism from moving fully unless the levers are lifted to the correct height. Many lever locks can be picked relatively easily with the proper tools, but picking would require using a pair of tools, with one being used to try to operate the mechanism which is blocked by the levers, while the other tool is used to try lifting the levers. Often, there will initially be one lever blocking the bolt; once that lever is moved to the right position (i.e. "set"), the bolt will be able to move a little bit before being blocked by another lever. If the bolt is kept under tension, this will rather conveniently hold the first lever in place while the picker focuses attention on the next lever that needs to be set.



            The best locks combine these two approaches, requiring intricately-cut keys which need to move several different levers simultaneously by relatively precise amounts. Such locks are much more expensive to manufacture than current designs. Although they may be as secure or even more so than most recent locks, the additional security they offer is not sufficient to justify their cost.



            I would not expect a closet door to have a particularly high-quality lock. If the lock uses warding to distinguish correct and incorrect keys, picking with crude tools may be easy. If it uses levers for that purpose, picking will require the simultaneous use of two tools that are designed to work together. There are many youtube videos and web tutorials that would explain how to make the required tools. If you can find some old keys that look like they would fit, I would suggest trying them and seeing what happens. If the key is blocked by something in the lock without engaging a mechanism, you probably have a warded lock. If the key engages the mechanism but the mechanism itself feels blocked, it's probably a lever lock.






            share|improve this answer








            New contributor




            supercat is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.




















              up vote
              11
              down vote










              up vote
              11
              down vote









              Vintage locks employed two concepts, sometimes individually and sometimes together.



              A warded lock has structures within the lock, called warding, which are designed to fit in notches carved into the key. A quality warded lock will be constructed so that the only way for a key to reach the mechanism is for it to snake around some complicated warding, but many cheaper warded locks can be opened with a skeleton key, which is a key blank that is filed down to remove everything except one or two simple projections or pairs of projections that will operate the mechanism. The way to defeat a quality warded lock is to construct a key by starting with a suitable key blank, covering it with soot or similar material, attempting to open the lock, moving the key back and forth a little at the place it is blocked, carefully removing it, and looking for markings in the soot. Cut, file, or otherwise remove the parts of the key where the soot was marked by the warding and try again. Either the lock will open, or new markings will appear, which again need to be removed. This process can sometimes be slow and tedious, but one will end up with a usable key, greatly increasing the value of the lock to a collector.



              Lever locks have one or more levers that must be lifted to the correct height to allow the bolt to move. Lever locks will often have a different feel from warded locks, since warded locks will usually block the key before it has a chance to engage the mechanism, while lever locks will allow the key to engage the mechanism but will block the mechanism from moving fully unless the levers are lifted to the correct height. Many lever locks can be picked relatively easily with the proper tools, but picking would require using a pair of tools, with one being used to try to operate the mechanism which is blocked by the levers, while the other tool is used to try lifting the levers. Often, there will initially be one lever blocking the bolt; once that lever is moved to the right position (i.e. "set"), the bolt will be able to move a little bit before being blocked by another lever. If the bolt is kept under tension, this will rather conveniently hold the first lever in place while the picker focuses attention on the next lever that needs to be set.



              The best locks combine these two approaches, requiring intricately-cut keys which need to move several different levers simultaneously by relatively precise amounts. Such locks are much more expensive to manufacture than current designs. Although they may be as secure or even more so than most recent locks, the additional security they offer is not sufficient to justify their cost.



              I would not expect a closet door to have a particularly high-quality lock. If the lock uses warding to distinguish correct and incorrect keys, picking with crude tools may be easy. If it uses levers for that purpose, picking will require the simultaneous use of two tools that are designed to work together. There are many youtube videos and web tutorials that would explain how to make the required tools. If you can find some old keys that look like they would fit, I would suggest trying them and seeing what happens. If the key is blocked by something in the lock without engaging a mechanism, you probably have a warded lock. If the key engages the mechanism but the mechanism itself feels blocked, it's probably a lever lock.






              share|improve this answer








              New contributor




              supercat is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
              Check out our Code of Conduct.









              Vintage locks employed two concepts, sometimes individually and sometimes together.



              A warded lock has structures within the lock, called warding, which are designed to fit in notches carved into the key. A quality warded lock will be constructed so that the only way for a key to reach the mechanism is for it to snake around some complicated warding, but many cheaper warded locks can be opened with a skeleton key, which is a key blank that is filed down to remove everything except one or two simple projections or pairs of projections that will operate the mechanism. The way to defeat a quality warded lock is to construct a key by starting with a suitable key blank, covering it with soot or similar material, attempting to open the lock, moving the key back and forth a little at the place it is blocked, carefully removing it, and looking for markings in the soot. Cut, file, or otherwise remove the parts of the key where the soot was marked by the warding and try again. Either the lock will open, or new markings will appear, which again need to be removed. This process can sometimes be slow and tedious, but one will end up with a usable key, greatly increasing the value of the lock to a collector.



              Lever locks have one or more levers that must be lifted to the correct height to allow the bolt to move. Lever locks will often have a different feel from warded locks, since warded locks will usually block the key before it has a chance to engage the mechanism, while lever locks will allow the key to engage the mechanism but will block the mechanism from moving fully unless the levers are lifted to the correct height. Many lever locks can be picked relatively easily with the proper tools, but picking would require using a pair of tools, with one being used to try to operate the mechanism which is blocked by the levers, while the other tool is used to try lifting the levers. Often, there will initially be one lever blocking the bolt; once that lever is moved to the right position (i.e. "set"), the bolt will be able to move a little bit before being blocked by another lever. If the bolt is kept under tension, this will rather conveniently hold the first lever in place while the picker focuses attention on the next lever that needs to be set.



              The best locks combine these two approaches, requiring intricately-cut keys which need to move several different levers simultaneously by relatively precise amounts. Such locks are much more expensive to manufacture than current designs. Although they may be as secure or even more so than most recent locks, the additional security they offer is not sufficient to justify their cost.



              I would not expect a closet door to have a particularly high-quality lock. If the lock uses warding to distinguish correct and incorrect keys, picking with crude tools may be easy. If it uses levers for that purpose, picking will require the simultaneous use of two tools that are designed to work together. There are many youtube videos and web tutorials that would explain how to make the required tools. If you can find some old keys that look like they would fit, I would suggest trying them and seeing what happens. If the key is blocked by something in the lock without engaging a mechanism, you probably have a warded lock. If the key engages the mechanism but the mechanism itself feels blocked, it's probably a lever lock.







              share|improve this answer








              New contributor




              supercat is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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              share|improve this answer






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              answered yesterday









              supercat

              21112




              21112




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                  up vote
                  7
                  down vote













                  Other suggested methods of removing the hinge pins or picking the locks are good.



                  You can also try to depress the latch via a thin wire if the door opens out or a thin plastic card if the door opens inward. What you goal would be is to depress the latch as if the door were closing on its own.






                  share|improve this answer










                  New contributor




                  Gary Bak is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.














                  • 2




                    This is what used to be call "jimmying" the door, then later came be "carding" the lock. Works well for simple locksets intended for interior doors.
                    – Zeiss Ikon
                    yesterday






                  • 3




                    That won't work because it is a deadbolt, not the ones with a spring
                    – Guillermo Vasconcelos
                    yesterday










                  • @GuillermoVasconcelos - yes my suggestion would not work then, picking seems like the best bet.
                    – Gary Bak
                    17 hours ago










                  • In BrE, a "jimmy" (or "jemmy") is usually a crowbar; it's not even vaguely the same as using a wire or card on the latch.
                    – Roger Lipscombe
                    15 hours ago










                  • @RogerLipscombe Can't talk to older history, but when I was a kid, a jimmy was what later became a "slim jim" -- mainly for opening car doors when the key was locked inside. Thin and flexible. Still won't work on a deadbolt, though.
                    – Zeiss Ikon
                    10 hours ago















                  up vote
                  7
                  down vote













                  Other suggested methods of removing the hinge pins or picking the locks are good.



                  You can also try to depress the latch via a thin wire if the door opens out or a thin plastic card if the door opens inward. What you goal would be is to depress the latch as if the door were closing on its own.






                  share|improve this answer










                  New contributor




                  Gary Bak is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.














                  • 2




                    This is what used to be call "jimmying" the door, then later came be "carding" the lock. Works well for simple locksets intended for interior doors.
                    – Zeiss Ikon
                    yesterday






                  • 3




                    That won't work because it is a deadbolt, not the ones with a spring
                    – Guillermo Vasconcelos
                    yesterday










                  • @GuillermoVasconcelos - yes my suggestion would not work then, picking seems like the best bet.
                    – Gary Bak
                    17 hours ago










                  • In BrE, a "jimmy" (or "jemmy") is usually a crowbar; it's not even vaguely the same as using a wire or card on the latch.
                    – Roger Lipscombe
                    15 hours ago










                  • @RogerLipscombe Can't talk to older history, but when I was a kid, a jimmy was what later became a "slim jim" -- mainly for opening car doors when the key was locked inside. Thin and flexible. Still won't work on a deadbolt, though.
                    – Zeiss Ikon
                    10 hours ago













                  up vote
                  7
                  down vote










                  up vote
                  7
                  down vote









                  Other suggested methods of removing the hinge pins or picking the locks are good.



                  You can also try to depress the latch via a thin wire if the door opens out or a thin plastic card if the door opens inward. What you goal would be is to depress the latch as if the door were closing on its own.






                  share|improve this answer










                  New contributor




                  Gary Bak is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.









                  Other suggested methods of removing the hinge pins or picking the locks are good.



                  You can also try to depress the latch via a thin wire if the door opens out or a thin plastic card if the door opens inward. What you goal would be is to depress the latch as if the door were closing on its own.







                  share|improve this answer










                  New contributor




                  Gary Bak is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.









                  share|improve this answer



                  share|improve this answer








                  edited 17 hours ago





















                  New contributor




                  Gary Bak is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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                  answered yesterday









                  Gary Bak

                  1712




                  1712




                  New contributor




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                  New contributor





                  Gary Bak is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.






                  Gary Bak is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                  Check out our Code of Conduct.








                  • 2




                    This is what used to be call "jimmying" the door, then later came be "carding" the lock. Works well for simple locksets intended for interior doors.
                    – Zeiss Ikon
                    yesterday






                  • 3




                    That won't work because it is a deadbolt, not the ones with a spring
                    – Guillermo Vasconcelos
                    yesterday










                  • @GuillermoVasconcelos - yes my suggestion would not work then, picking seems like the best bet.
                    – Gary Bak
                    17 hours ago










                  • In BrE, a "jimmy" (or "jemmy") is usually a crowbar; it's not even vaguely the same as using a wire or card on the latch.
                    – Roger Lipscombe
                    15 hours ago










                  • @RogerLipscombe Can't talk to older history, but when I was a kid, a jimmy was what later became a "slim jim" -- mainly for opening car doors when the key was locked inside. Thin and flexible. Still won't work on a deadbolt, though.
                    – Zeiss Ikon
                    10 hours ago














                  • 2




                    This is what used to be call "jimmying" the door, then later came be "carding" the lock. Works well for simple locksets intended for interior doors.
                    – Zeiss Ikon
                    yesterday






                  • 3




                    That won't work because it is a deadbolt, not the ones with a spring
                    – Guillermo Vasconcelos
                    yesterday










                  • @GuillermoVasconcelos - yes my suggestion would not work then, picking seems like the best bet.
                    – Gary Bak
                    17 hours ago










                  • In BrE, a "jimmy" (or "jemmy") is usually a crowbar; it's not even vaguely the same as using a wire or card on the latch.
                    – Roger Lipscombe
                    15 hours ago










                  • @RogerLipscombe Can't talk to older history, but when I was a kid, a jimmy was what later became a "slim jim" -- mainly for opening car doors when the key was locked inside. Thin and flexible. Still won't work on a deadbolt, though.
                    – Zeiss Ikon
                    10 hours ago








                  2




                  2




                  This is what used to be call "jimmying" the door, then later came be "carding" the lock. Works well for simple locksets intended for interior doors.
                  – Zeiss Ikon
                  yesterday




                  This is what used to be call "jimmying" the door, then later came be "carding" the lock. Works well for simple locksets intended for interior doors.
                  – Zeiss Ikon
                  yesterday




                  3




                  3




                  That won't work because it is a deadbolt, not the ones with a spring
                  – Guillermo Vasconcelos
                  yesterday




                  That won't work because it is a deadbolt, not the ones with a spring
                  – Guillermo Vasconcelos
                  yesterday












                  @GuillermoVasconcelos - yes my suggestion would not work then, picking seems like the best bet.
                  – Gary Bak
                  17 hours ago




                  @GuillermoVasconcelos - yes my suggestion would not work then, picking seems like the best bet.
                  – Gary Bak
                  17 hours ago












                  In BrE, a "jimmy" (or "jemmy") is usually a crowbar; it's not even vaguely the same as using a wire or card on the latch.
                  – Roger Lipscombe
                  15 hours ago




                  In BrE, a "jimmy" (or "jemmy") is usually a crowbar; it's not even vaguely the same as using a wire or card on the latch.
                  – Roger Lipscombe
                  15 hours ago












                  @RogerLipscombe Can't talk to older history, but when I was a kid, a jimmy was what later became a "slim jim" -- mainly for opening car doors when the key was locked inside. Thin and flexible. Still won't work on a deadbolt, though.
                  – Zeiss Ikon
                  10 hours ago




                  @RogerLipscombe Can't talk to older history, but when I was a kid, a jimmy was what later became a "slim jim" -- mainly for opening car doors when the key was locked inside. Thin and flexible. Still won't work on a deadbolt, though.
                  – Zeiss Ikon
                  10 hours ago










                  up vote
                  5
                  down vote













                  The original image of the key is interesting to me. You could just wander into the local locksmith and ask if they have a set of keys that might fit. There's a limited number of variants on these keys and you may just be able to buy one off the shelf as the lock is only a token gesture towards security.



                  If you're not overly attached to the lock, there's the question of how firmly it's attached. many cabinet locks are lightly attached to the inside of the door and if you attach a decent handle to the outside you could possibly just force it open. Though the hinges are quite heavy duty which implies a more solid door and lock mechanism.






                  share|improve this answer

























                    up vote
                    5
                    down vote













                    The original image of the key is interesting to me. You could just wander into the local locksmith and ask if they have a set of keys that might fit. There's a limited number of variants on these keys and you may just be able to buy one off the shelf as the lock is only a token gesture towards security.



                    If you're not overly attached to the lock, there's the question of how firmly it's attached. many cabinet locks are lightly attached to the inside of the door and if you attach a decent handle to the outside you could possibly just force it open. Though the hinges are quite heavy duty which implies a more solid door and lock mechanism.






                    share|improve this answer























                      up vote
                      5
                      down vote










                      up vote
                      5
                      down vote









                      The original image of the key is interesting to me. You could just wander into the local locksmith and ask if they have a set of keys that might fit. There's a limited number of variants on these keys and you may just be able to buy one off the shelf as the lock is only a token gesture towards security.



                      If you're not overly attached to the lock, there's the question of how firmly it's attached. many cabinet locks are lightly attached to the inside of the door and if you attach a decent handle to the outside you could possibly just force it open. Though the hinges are quite heavy duty which implies a more solid door and lock mechanism.






                      share|improve this answer












                      The original image of the key is interesting to me. You could just wander into the local locksmith and ask if they have a set of keys that might fit. There's a limited number of variants on these keys and you may just be able to buy one off the shelf as the lock is only a token gesture towards security.



                      If you're not overly attached to the lock, there's the question of how firmly it's attached. many cabinet locks are lightly attached to the inside of the door and if you attach a decent handle to the outside you could possibly just force it open. Though the hinges are quite heavy duty which implies a more solid door and lock mechanism.







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                      answered 14 hours ago









                      Separatrix

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                          Well, if you don't care about locking it again, I'd find my trusty old Fein multimaster cutter and just cut the lock open. Or if you want the gentle solution use a small hacksaw blade.






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                            up vote
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                            Well, if you don't care about locking it again, I'd find my trusty old Fein multimaster cutter and just cut the lock open. Or if you want the gentle solution use a small hacksaw blade.






                            share|improve this answer























                              up vote
                              0
                              down vote










                              up vote
                              0
                              down vote









                              Well, if you don't care about locking it again, I'd find my trusty old Fein multimaster cutter and just cut the lock open. Or if you want the gentle solution use a small hacksaw blade.






                              share|improve this answer












                              Well, if you don't care about locking it again, I'd find my trusty old Fein multimaster cutter and just cut the lock open. Or if you want the gentle solution use a small hacksaw blade.







                              share|improve this answer












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                              answered 6 hours ago









                              Stian Yttervik

                              1712




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                                  Use a punch and hammer. Insert the punch where the key would go...use the hammer to drive the lock mechanism off the back of the door. A couple of good whacks and you should be wide open. Shame to bust it though..I would try the bobby pin method first.






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                                    up vote
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                                    down vote













                                    Use a punch and hammer. Insert the punch where the key would go...use the hammer to drive the lock mechanism off the back of the door. A couple of good whacks and you should be wide open. Shame to bust it though..I would try the bobby pin method first.






                                    share|improve this answer








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                                      up vote
                                      0
                                      down vote










                                      up vote
                                      0
                                      down vote









                                      Use a punch and hammer. Insert the punch where the key would go...use the hammer to drive the lock mechanism off the back of the door. A couple of good whacks and you should be wide open. Shame to bust it though..I would try the bobby pin method first.






                                      share|improve this answer








                                      New contributor




                                      dazrite is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                      Check out our Code of Conduct.









                                      Use a punch and hammer. Insert the punch where the key would go...use the hammer to drive the lock mechanism off the back of the door. A couple of good whacks and you should be wide open. Shame to bust it though..I would try the bobby pin method first.







                                      share|improve this answer








                                      New contributor




                                      dazrite is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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                                      answered 2 hours ago









                                      dazrite

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