$A^TJA = J$ $ rightarrow det(A) = 1$











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Why is this true? I cant seem to understand why the $det(A) = 1$ for this to hold?










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  • What is $J$? If $J$ is a non-singular skew-symmetric matrix then one can indeed show that $det A=1$.
    – Fabian
    Dec 2 at 20:50










  • Before dealing with matrices, try scalars. If $a^2 j = j$ then we can have $a = pm 1$. So it cannot be true for matrices.
    – copper.hat
    Dec 2 at 21:14

















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0
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Why is this true? I cant seem to understand why the $det(A) = 1$ for this to hold?










share|cite|improve this question
























  • What is $J$? If $J$ is a non-singular skew-symmetric matrix then one can indeed show that $det A=1$.
    – Fabian
    Dec 2 at 20:50










  • Before dealing with matrices, try scalars. If $a^2 j = j$ then we can have $a = pm 1$. So it cannot be true for matrices.
    – copper.hat
    Dec 2 at 21:14















up vote
0
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Why is this true? I cant seem to understand why the $det(A) = 1$ for this to hold?










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Why is this true? I cant seem to understand why the $det(A) = 1$ for this to hold?







differential-equations pde determinant matrix-calculus






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edited Dec 2 at 20:42









Bernard

117k637109




117k637109










asked Dec 2 at 20:39









pablo_mathscobar

626




626












  • What is $J$? If $J$ is a non-singular skew-symmetric matrix then one can indeed show that $det A=1$.
    – Fabian
    Dec 2 at 20:50










  • Before dealing with matrices, try scalars. If $a^2 j = j$ then we can have $a = pm 1$. So it cannot be true for matrices.
    – copper.hat
    Dec 2 at 21:14




















  • What is $J$? If $J$ is a non-singular skew-symmetric matrix then one can indeed show that $det A=1$.
    – Fabian
    Dec 2 at 20:50










  • Before dealing with matrices, try scalars. If $a^2 j = j$ then we can have $a = pm 1$. So it cannot be true for matrices.
    – copper.hat
    Dec 2 at 21:14


















What is $J$? If $J$ is a non-singular skew-symmetric matrix then one can indeed show that $det A=1$.
– Fabian
Dec 2 at 20:50




What is $J$? If $J$ is a non-singular skew-symmetric matrix then one can indeed show that $det A=1$.
– Fabian
Dec 2 at 20:50












Before dealing with matrices, try scalars. If $a^2 j = j$ then we can have $a = pm 1$. So it cannot be true for matrices.
– copper.hat
Dec 2 at 21:14






Before dealing with matrices, try scalars. If $a^2 j = j$ then we can have $a = pm 1$. So it cannot be true for matrices.
– copper.hat
Dec 2 at 21:14












5 Answers
5






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up vote
2
down vote













It is not indeed the case. We might have $$det (A)=-1$$ since $$det(A^TJA)=det(J)$$yields to $$det(A^T)det(J)det(A)=det(J)$$and if $J$ is invertible (i.e. the determinant is non-zero) we conclude $$det(A)^2=1$$if $J$ is singuler ($det(J)=0$) we cannot determine $det (A)$






share|cite|improve this answer





















  • Thats what i thought, thank you
    – pablo_mathscobar
    Dec 2 at 20:47










  • You're welcome. Good luck!
    – Mostafa Ayaz
    Dec 2 at 20:48


















up vote
2
down vote













I assume the matrices are over the real numbers.




  • In general, $det J$ can be anything.


  • If $J$ is invertible, then one can show that $det A = pm 1$ (see for example the answer by MostafaAyaz)


  • If $J$ is invertible and antisymmetric with $J= -J^T$, then one can show that $det A =1$. The proof of this fact is not completely elementary as it involves the Pfaffian with $$operatorname{Pf}(A^T J A) = det(A) operatorname{Pf}( J) ,.$$
    As $A^T J A =J$ and $J$ is not singular, we follow $det A=1$.







share|cite|improve this answer




























    up vote
    1
    down vote













    It is not true in all cases. The determinant is multiplicative, , and $det vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}A=det A$, so
    $$det(vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}AJA)=(det A)^2det J$$
    and if it is equal to $det J$ and $det Jne 0$, you can deduce $det A=pm1$.






    share|cite|improve this answer




























      up vote
      0
      down vote













      We assume $det A >0$



      The multiplicative property of determinant implies $$ det A^T JA =(det A)^2 det J =det J$$
      You may cancel $det J $ and the result follows. We are also-assuming that $det J ne 0$






      share|cite|improve this answer




























        up vote
        -1
        down vote













        It is not true in full generality. For instance, if you are dealing with $1×1$ matrices, then matrix multiplication boils down to ordinary multiplication and the equation would be $Acdot Acdot J = J$, so assuming we are working over the rationals (though this can be generalized), we have $J=0$ or $A=1$ or $A=-1$.
        In fact, this example can be generalized by applying the determinant to both sides of the equation and noting that $det (A^T)=det(A)$. This gives $det(A)^2 times det(J) = det(J)$, so if $det(J)$ is not zero, then $det(A)=1$ or $det(A)=-1$.






        share|cite|improve this answer










        New contributor




        Rik Bos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.


















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          5 Answers
          5






          active

          oldest

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          5 Answers
          5






          active

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          active

          oldest

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          active

          oldest

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          up vote
          2
          down vote













          It is not indeed the case. We might have $$det (A)=-1$$ since $$det(A^TJA)=det(J)$$yields to $$det(A^T)det(J)det(A)=det(J)$$and if $J$ is invertible (i.e. the determinant is non-zero) we conclude $$det(A)^2=1$$if $J$ is singuler ($det(J)=0$) we cannot determine $det (A)$






          share|cite|improve this answer





















          • Thats what i thought, thank you
            – pablo_mathscobar
            Dec 2 at 20:47










          • You're welcome. Good luck!
            – Mostafa Ayaz
            Dec 2 at 20:48















          up vote
          2
          down vote













          It is not indeed the case. We might have $$det (A)=-1$$ since $$det(A^TJA)=det(J)$$yields to $$det(A^T)det(J)det(A)=det(J)$$and if $J$ is invertible (i.e. the determinant is non-zero) we conclude $$det(A)^2=1$$if $J$ is singuler ($det(J)=0$) we cannot determine $det (A)$






          share|cite|improve this answer





















          • Thats what i thought, thank you
            – pablo_mathscobar
            Dec 2 at 20:47










          • You're welcome. Good luck!
            – Mostafa Ayaz
            Dec 2 at 20:48













          up vote
          2
          down vote










          up vote
          2
          down vote









          It is not indeed the case. We might have $$det (A)=-1$$ since $$det(A^TJA)=det(J)$$yields to $$det(A^T)det(J)det(A)=det(J)$$and if $J$ is invertible (i.e. the determinant is non-zero) we conclude $$det(A)^2=1$$if $J$ is singuler ($det(J)=0$) we cannot determine $det (A)$






          share|cite|improve this answer












          It is not indeed the case. We might have $$det (A)=-1$$ since $$det(A^TJA)=det(J)$$yields to $$det(A^T)det(J)det(A)=det(J)$$and if $J$ is invertible (i.e. the determinant is non-zero) we conclude $$det(A)^2=1$$if $J$ is singuler ($det(J)=0$) we cannot determine $det (A)$







          share|cite|improve this answer












          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer










          answered Dec 2 at 20:46









          Mostafa Ayaz

          13.4k3836




          13.4k3836












          • Thats what i thought, thank you
            – pablo_mathscobar
            Dec 2 at 20:47










          • You're welcome. Good luck!
            – Mostafa Ayaz
            Dec 2 at 20:48


















          • Thats what i thought, thank you
            – pablo_mathscobar
            Dec 2 at 20:47










          • You're welcome. Good luck!
            – Mostafa Ayaz
            Dec 2 at 20:48
















          Thats what i thought, thank you
          – pablo_mathscobar
          Dec 2 at 20:47




          Thats what i thought, thank you
          – pablo_mathscobar
          Dec 2 at 20:47












          You're welcome. Good luck!
          – Mostafa Ayaz
          Dec 2 at 20:48




          You're welcome. Good luck!
          – Mostafa Ayaz
          Dec 2 at 20:48










          up vote
          2
          down vote













          I assume the matrices are over the real numbers.




          • In general, $det J$ can be anything.


          • If $J$ is invertible, then one can show that $det A = pm 1$ (see for example the answer by MostafaAyaz)


          • If $J$ is invertible and antisymmetric with $J= -J^T$, then one can show that $det A =1$. The proof of this fact is not completely elementary as it involves the Pfaffian with $$operatorname{Pf}(A^T J A) = det(A) operatorname{Pf}( J) ,.$$
            As $A^T J A =J$ and $J$ is not singular, we follow $det A=1$.







          share|cite|improve this answer

























            up vote
            2
            down vote













            I assume the matrices are over the real numbers.




            • In general, $det J$ can be anything.


            • If $J$ is invertible, then one can show that $det A = pm 1$ (see for example the answer by MostafaAyaz)


            • If $J$ is invertible and antisymmetric with $J= -J^T$, then one can show that $det A =1$. The proof of this fact is not completely elementary as it involves the Pfaffian with $$operatorname{Pf}(A^T J A) = det(A) operatorname{Pf}( J) ,.$$
              As $A^T J A =J$ and $J$ is not singular, we follow $det A=1$.







            share|cite|improve this answer























              up vote
              2
              down vote










              up vote
              2
              down vote









              I assume the matrices are over the real numbers.




              • In general, $det J$ can be anything.


              • If $J$ is invertible, then one can show that $det A = pm 1$ (see for example the answer by MostafaAyaz)


              • If $J$ is invertible and antisymmetric with $J= -J^T$, then one can show that $det A =1$. The proof of this fact is not completely elementary as it involves the Pfaffian with $$operatorname{Pf}(A^T J A) = det(A) operatorname{Pf}( J) ,.$$
                As $A^T J A =J$ and $J$ is not singular, we follow $det A=1$.







              share|cite|improve this answer












              I assume the matrices are over the real numbers.




              • In general, $det J$ can be anything.


              • If $J$ is invertible, then one can show that $det A = pm 1$ (see for example the answer by MostafaAyaz)


              • If $J$ is invertible and antisymmetric with $J= -J^T$, then one can show that $det A =1$. The proof of this fact is not completely elementary as it involves the Pfaffian with $$operatorname{Pf}(A^T J A) = det(A) operatorname{Pf}( J) ,.$$
                As $A^T J A =J$ and $J$ is not singular, we follow $det A=1$.








              share|cite|improve this answer












              share|cite|improve this answer



              share|cite|improve this answer










              answered Dec 2 at 20:54









              Fabian

              19.2k3674




              19.2k3674






















                  up vote
                  1
                  down vote













                  It is not true in all cases. The determinant is multiplicative, , and $det vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}A=det A$, so
                  $$det(vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}AJA)=(det A)^2det J$$
                  and if it is equal to $det J$ and $det Jne 0$, you can deduce $det A=pm1$.






                  share|cite|improve this answer

























                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote













                    It is not true in all cases. The determinant is multiplicative, , and $det vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}A=det A$, so
                    $$det(vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}AJA)=(det A)^2det J$$
                    and if it is equal to $det J$ and $det Jne 0$, you can deduce $det A=pm1$.






                    share|cite|improve this answer























                      up vote
                      1
                      down vote










                      up vote
                      1
                      down vote









                      It is not true in all cases. The determinant is multiplicative, , and $det vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}A=det A$, so
                      $$det(vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}AJA)=(det A)^2det J$$
                      and if it is equal to $det J$ and $det Jne 0$, you can deduce $det A=pm1$.






                      share|cite|improve this answer












                      It is not true in all cases. The determinant is multiplicative, , and $det vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}A=det A$, so
                      $$det(vphantom{A}^{mathrm tmkern -5mu}AJA)=(det A)^2det J$$
                      and if it is equal to $det J$ and $det Jne 0$, you can deduce $det A=pm1$.







                      share|cite|improve this answer












                      share|cite|improve this answer



                      share|cite|improve this answer










                      answered Dec 2 at 20:48









                      Bernard

                      117k637109




                      117k637109






















                          up vote
                          0
                          down vote













                          We assume $det A >0$



                          The multiplicative property of determinant implies $$ det A^T JA =(det A)^2 det J =det J$$
                          You may cancel $det J $ and the result follows. We are also-assuming that $det J ne 0$






                          share|cite|improve this answer

























                            up vote
                            0
                            down vote













                            We assume $det A >0$



                            The multiplicative property of determinant implies $$ det A^T JA =(det A)^2 det J =det J$$
                            You may cancel $det J $ and the result follows. We are also-assuming that $det J ne 0$






                            share|cite|improve this answer























                              up vote
                              0
                              down vote










                              up vote
                              0
                              down vote









                              We assume $det A >0$



                              The multiplicative property of determinant implies $$ det A^T JA =(det A)^2 det J =det J$$
                              You may cancel $det J $ and the result follows. We are also-assuming that $det J ne 0$






                              share|cite|improve this answer












                              We assume $det A >0$



                              The multiplicative property of determinant implies $$ det A^T JA =(det A)^2 det J =det J$$
                              You may cancel $det J $ and the result follows. We are also-assuming that $det J ne 0$







                              share|cite|improve this answer












                              share|cite|improve this answer



                              share|cite|improve this answer










                              answered Dec 2 at 20:50









                              Mohammad Riazi-Kermani

                              40.3k41958




                              40.3k41958






















                                  up vote
                                  -1
                                  down vote













                                  It is not true in full generality. For instance, if you are dealing with $1×1$ matrices, then matrix multiplication boils down to ordinary multiplication and the equation would be $Acdot Acdot J = J$, so assuming we are working over the rationals (though this can be generalized), we have $J=0$ or $A=1$ or $A=-1$.
                                  In fact, this example can be generalized by applying the determinant to both sides of the equation and noting that $det (A^T)=det(A)$. This gives $det(A)^2 times det(J) = det(J)$, so if $det(J)$ is not zero, then $det(A)=1$ or $det(A)=-1$.






                                  share|cite|improve this answer










                                  New contributor




                                  Rik Bos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                  Check out our Code of Conduct.






















                                    up vote
                                    -1
                                    down vote













                                    It is not true in full generality. For instance, if you are dealing with $1×1$ matrices, then matrix multiplication boils down to ordinary multiplication and the equation would be $Acdot Acdot J = J$, so assuming we are working over the rationals (though this can be generalized), we have $J=0$ or $A=1$ or $A=-1$.
                                    In fact, this example can be generalized by applying the determinant to both sides of the equation and noting that $det (A^T)=det(A)$. This gives $det(A)^2 times det(J) = det(J)$, so if $det(J)$ is not zero, then $det(A)=1$ or $det(A)=-1$.






                                    share|cite|improve this answer










                                    New contributor




                                    Rik Bos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                    Check out our Code of Conduct.




















                                      up vote
                                      -1
                                      down vote










                                      up vote
                                      -1
                                      down vote









                                      It is not true in full generality. For instance, if you are dealing with $1×1$ matrices, then matrix multiplication boils down to ordinary multiplication and the equation would be $Acdot Acdot J = J$, so assuming we are working over the rationals (though this can be generalized), we have $J=0$ or $A=1$ or $A=-1$.
                                      In fact, this example can be generalized by applying the determinant to both sides of the equation and noting that $det (A^T)=det(A)$. This gives $det(A)^2 times det(J) = det(J)$, so if $det(J)$ is not zero, then $det(A)=1$ or $det(A)=-1$.






                                      share|cite|improve this answer










                                      New contributor




                                      Rik Bos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                      Check out our Code of Conduct.









                                      It is not true in full generality. For instance, if you are dealing with $1×1$ matrices, then matrix multiplication boils down to ordinary multiplication and the equation would be $Acdot Acdot J = J$, so assuming we are working over the rationals (though this can be generalized), we have $J=0$ or $A=1$ or $A=-1$.
                                      In fact, this example can be generalized by applying the determinant to both sides of the equation and noting that $det (A^T)=det(A)$. This gives $det(A)^2 times det(J) = det(J)$, so if $det(J)$ is not zero, then $det(A)=1$ or $det(A)=-1$.







                                      share|cite|improve this answer










                                      New contributor




                                      Rik Bos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                      Check out our Code of Conduct.









                                      share|cite|improve this answer



                                      share|cite|improve this answer








                                      edited Dec 3 at 4:55









                                      Tianlalu

                                      2,9801936




                                      2,9801936






                                      New contributor




                                      Rik Bos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                      Check out our Code of Conduct.









                                      answered Dec 2 at 21:09









                                      Rik Bos

                                      1




                                      1




                                      New contributor




                                      Rik Bos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                      Check out our Code of Conduct.





                                      New contributor





                                      Rik Bos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                      Check out our Code of Conduct.






                                      Rik Bos is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                                      Check out our Code of Conduct.






























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